There’s been a lot of talk over the years about a bike route along Cornwall and Point Grey Road.
Former NPA councillor Peter Ladner was an early proponent. The city’s current map of future bike-route plans identifies it as a key connecting route from the already bike-ified Burrard Bridge out to the west side.
Now, for once, locals are getting solidly behind the idea. Or, well, maybe not quite, but in their quest to reduce the 13,000-strong daily car volume on that stretch of road, that might be the solution.
90 responses so far ↓
1 teririch // Oct 3, 2012 at 11:24 am
I was wondering when this story was going to pop up.
Over the past month, they had laid electronic car counters at various locations on Cornwall, Kits Beach walkway entrance, Macdonald and West 4th.
If they were to run a seperated bike lane down West 4th – it would be the death knell for many businessess – where the ‘For Lease’ sign is already extremely popular.
Cornwall is a transportation hub for workers, seniors in the area (there are senior’s homes on Conrwall) people heading to schools, families…. so do they plan on removing transit ( the 2, 22 and 32 buses) that services the many in order to provide bike lanes that service the few?
Anyone who buses this route knows what it is like during peak hours, especially when the weather turns and the buses are packed by time they hit Macdonald and 4th. (And all those cyclists turn to transit rather than weathering the cold and the rain)
We won’t even touch on spring /summer when the beach is ‘the’ popular place to be.
And for those people that live in the immediate area in any one of the many apartment buildings and use the street parking for personal use – here is yet another screw you.
Great thinking – again.
2 Higgins // Oct 3, 2012 at 11:29 am
This cannot even be seen as NIMBY-ism anymore. This is basically a shot at creating a new habitat for the multimillionaires, a sanctuary for their waterfront McMansions. I see this as a better alternative to that idiotic Seawall extension. Hope that is not going forward.
As if it wasn’t enough they instituted a 30km/h speed limit zone on a road with no SCHOOLS or Parks or playgrounds ( for the chosen ones all the best right?) now they want to ban the cars all together.
““It’s really scary living here,” said Pamela McColl”
ROTFLMAO!
If that’s scary go ltry the Knight/ Kingsway or Hastings/ Main or Cambie/41st…
What clowns. Please you Point Grey Princesses, don’t insult our intelligence!
And so the war on cars continues every which way.
3 teririch // Oct 3, 2012 at 11:34 am
Okay, I need to add to my first comment as I have ‘read’ the article’ (soory for the kneejerk reaction)
So the city and the ‘Creme de la Creme’ of Point Grey want all the traffic diverted to Macdonald and onto West 4th – again, both already busy routes.
I do love the reference of ‘walling’ off the Point Grey area – how imperialistic.
4 rmac // Oct 3, 2012 at 11:38 am
I grew up very close to Point Grey Road and can attest to the fact that the residents on the water side of the street have always resented having to share their little spot of heaven with the great unwashed. This idea of closing of a main thoroughfare is ridiculous and smacks of pandering to the wealthy. (Perhaps the pandering is why Jacquie Cohen gets to use the park adjacent to her house on Point Grey as a parking lot when she has a party).
5 Richard // Oct 3, 2012 at 12:00 pm
@teririch
Now, even without any type of bikes lanes, over 10% of traffic along Cornwall is bicycles. Add separated bike lanes and the number of people of all ages will increase dramatically. Often, cyclists are using the curb lane anyway so reallocating it for bikes won’t impact traffic much.
With so many people in this part of town, bike lanes along 4th would likely be good for business. As you point out, many are not doing well right now with it as a high-speed commuter route. Traffic speeding by does businesses no good making the street miserable for people to walk or cycle to businesses.
Note that there is only one for lease sign on Hornby and I believe none on Dunsmuir. Pretty much anything that comes up for lease gets leased quickly.
6 Bob // Oct 3, 2012 at 12:05 pm
This is an obvious bike route. It’s already a very high traffic route for bikes. It’s hardly a ‘major thoroughfare’ as one commenter said, unless you’re on your way to the Royal Van Yacht Club there aren’t any non-residential destinations on this road at all.
7 carmen // Oct 3, 2012 at 12:11 pm
Awesome. I have 3 friends who have been hit by cars while cycling on Pt Grey Rd – it’s a deathtrap, and the alternate routes are very clumsy and so hard to blame folks for wanting to take the more direct route. Kudos to a Council the really gets it.
8 carmen // Oct 3, 2012 at 12:14 pm
Oh, make that 4 – i forgot to mention that i myself got hit on Pt Grey Rd. right in front of George Puill’s house in 2001, by a student driver who hit the gas instead of the brake by accident. I was in a leg brace for 2 months.
9 Mira // Oct 3, 2012 at 12:28 pm
rmac… 4
“(Perhaps the pandering is why Jacquie Cohen gets to use the park adjacent to her house on Point Grey as a parking lot when she has a party).”
Got that one right!
Tom Jones needs to park somewhere when he’s in town visiting, though now he could simply bike on their private road. Sweet!
10 teririch // Oct 3, 2012 at 12:33 pm
@Richard:
Sorry, but a bike lane on West 4th will hurt business just as it did, or was reported as so, along other routes such as Hornby and Dunsmuir regardless of how the cycling community attempts to paint it. Just because at this time there is one ‘For Lease’ sign doesn’t mean there hasn’t been a loss in revenue.
Or are you suggesting that viola, if a cycle lane goes in all of these’ new’ customers that never frequent the area are going to show up… and buy?
Traffic does not speed by on West 4th – if you look, evey parking stall is taken, and people are circling the blocks looking for space – it is a destination shopping area.
Most locals in the area walk or bus – if they are cabable and if it suits their needs.
As for Cornwall – there is a senior’s home located one bus stop up west from Yew (can’t remember the stop) on Cornwall.
Please do not tell me that these people will hop on a bike to do their shopping and for getting around – many are in wheelchairs or use walking devices.
Taking the bus away from them is just cruel.
Taking the buses off this route will greatly impact many people’s live in a negative way.
Not everyone wants to bike or can bike.
11 rmac // Oct 3, 2012 at 12:38 pm
Carmen, George Puil does not live on the part of Point Grey Road we’re talking about. He also, by the way, managed to get tour buses rerouted from the parking lot by the Maritime Museum because it was too much traffic for him (he is right across the street from it),
12 Richard // Oct 3, 2012 at 12:43 pm
Seriously @teririch, no one is even suggesting removing the buses from Cornwall. Please don’t make up false positions then claim people support them.
Not everybody can or wants to drive either. Nor is anyone suggesting to ban traffic from Cornwall or 4th. By your logic, there should not be any roads for cars because not everyone drives. Clearly a faulty arguement that no one is making so I’m not sure why anyone would make the same argument for not having safe all ages bike lanes.
Now how about debating reasonable proposals like safely accommodating bikes, cars, buses and pedestrians along streets like Cornwall.
13 teririch // Oct 3, 2012 at 12:46 pm
Richard:
If you take out a lane of traffic on Cornwall in order to make a bike lane – where are you moving the buses to?
Same on West 4th?
14 Andy_F // Oct 3, 2012 at 1:07 pm
teririch
You move the buses to the remaining lane. Oh and how many buses go past the turn onto Macdonald currently there? As others have mentioned during morning and afternoon rush the curb lane is a bike/transit lane already. I see that because I ride year round.
15 teririch // Oct 3, 2012 at 1:23 pm
@Andy_F:
So the buses are moved to one lane in one direction (I would pray it is only one lane getting taken out) – which will tie up the commute – expotentially.
And where do the bus stops move to?
Again, not a well thought out plan.
16 Frank Ducote // Oct 3, 2012 at 1:23 pm
A partial solution lies at the south end of the Burrard Street Bridge. As currently aligned, it actually leads southbound drivers as much or more toward Cornwall/Point Grey Road rather than south along Burrard Street, where 4th Avenue could be emphasized as the preferred westbound route of choice.
Reconfiguring this alignment, as well as reducing the eastbound 3 lanes along Cornwall to, say, two lanes, would help restrict the speedy access to and from this street. Through traffic belongs more on Burrard and 4th than along Cornwall and Point Grey Road.
Incidentally, if this change were to be made in the right way, a significant amount of “new” land – reclaimed road space – could be captured on the northwest corner of this huge intersection and used for other purposes than vehicular traffic. Such as for a small park, community gardens, public art or even housing.
17 Alex // Oct 3, 2012 at 1:50 pm
I’m glad that change is being considered. The current situation seems dangerous. A colleague collided with a car on Point Grey Road while biking to the office downtown last summer. It was terrifying for driver and cyclist.
When I’m driving, it’s really hard to know when to pass a bike without risking a head-on with opposing traffic. When cycling it’s hard to know whether to hug to the parked cars and risk getting doored in order to allow cars to pass or to take the lane and wait for a gap in parked cars to allow cars to pass.
I tend to take the hilly and poorly connected/aligned bike streets to the South because I don’t mind hammering up hills and don’t like breathing exhaust, but I can see why the young and the old and those who don’t do endurance sports choose the more direct seaside route.
It’s a current weak link in our multi-modal transport network and I’m sure that the status quo is not the best solution that we can come up with as a community.
18 waltyss // Oct 3, 2012 at 1:50 pm
@terrrich:
If this council reinvented manna from heaven you and the others would be opposed.
I drive Point Grey every day. The buses do not go west of Macdonald but divert onto Macdonald. The 2 and the 22 go up Macdonald to either 16th Avenue or further. The 32 which is a rush hour bus turns onto Macdonald and then 4th.
The old folks home is on Cornwall and no-one is talking about removing buses from Cornwall.
Jacqui Cohen’s house is east of Macdonald and again no-one is talking about removing cars or buses from that stretch of Point Grey Road.
@teririch #1 and 2. You would have thought that spewing before you actually read the article and then seeing that you were completely wrong might slow you down even a bit. But the drive to be negative is sooooo strong that you just carry on. A classic teririch, I’m against it and I’ll let you know when I figure out why.
And, like it or not, you are going to get bike lanes on either Cornwall/Point Grey or even both. I would think that bike lanes on Cornwall/Point Grey makes most sense. But even on 4th Avenue, separated bike lanes would make sense. They didn’t hurt business downtown and they won’t there.
Beyond MacDonald, it is really unsafe for both bicycles and cars. Cars or bicycles has to go. I always thought that 1st or 2nd was supposed to be a bike route but have not checked.
19 Richard // Oct 3, 2012 at 2:04 pm
@teririch
Most of the time, there is parking along Cornwall so their is only 1 lane in each direction. As well, with the proposed diversion of traffic from Point Grey, I expect much of the commuter traffic to not bother with Cornwall. Buses might even move faster with less traffic to block them. The bikes would not slow down the buses either.
Anyway, safety should be the priority over the movement of traffic. Separated bike lanes would slow down traffic making the street safer for pedestrians, motorists and cyclists. With separated bike lanes, bikes would not be in the same lane as the buses slowing them down either.
Collisions cause the worst traffic delays for buses and other traffic. Fewer collisions are better for traffic flow.
Slower traffic also means less noise for people at the beach and living along Cornwall. A nice side benefit.
20 Frank Ducote // Oct 3, 2012 at 2:31 pm
Richard and Walt – good cop/bad cop.
21 teririch // Oct 3, 2012 at 3:39 pm
@waltyss #18:
I’ve lived in Kits and in the discussed area for over 20 years – so I am extremely familar with the bus routes and where they run. Just as an FYI – I take the bus everyday to work – I catch it at Macdonald and 4th so kindly don’t try to lecture me on the traffic patterns of the area.
If they are looking at closing off Point Grey at Macdonald and thru to Alma for bike traffic – then it has to connect somewhere and sorry if it is a leap for me and others to think that connection would be Cornwall – a heavy traffic area during rush hour commutes.
You might want to check on the negative impact the spearated bike lanes had on business on both Hornby and Dunsmuir before you state ‘they didn’t hurt business downtown’. That is a flase. And to try to mitigate the ‘damage’ the cycling community started up a Facebook site urging their members to ‘visit’ shops in the area.
Businesses lost revenue.
I find it quite fancinating that instead of arguig the point, you digress to attacking the poster. It seems to be your fallback position.
Oh, and it is 3rd that has the bike route, not 1rst or 2nd.
22 teririch // Oct 3, 2012 at 3:46 pm
@Richard #19:
Praticallity trumps safety.
Safety seems to be the first arguement of the cycling community and to heck with everything and everybody else.
The 2 lanes that house parking during the day convert to flow thru lanes for the buses during peak hours so buses typically don’t get tied up in rush traffic.
And it still doen’t answer the question – if you remove the outside lane on either side in order to convert it to a bike lane- where do the bus stops get located to? Is there a paltform for people to embark/disemark to/from the buses?
Odd, in all my years living there and traveling the area I’ve yet to be tied up during commute time due to an accident.
23 ThinkOutsideABox // Oct 3, 2012 at 4:02 pm
I like Frank’s suggestion and agree, Pt. Grey road is dangerous on bike.
24 Brian // Oct 3, 2012 at 4:15 pm
It’s good to see this moving forward. W 3rd is a problematic bike route, and Cornwall/Point Grey cannot serve as an artery. The street is a very popular undesignated bike route that also happens to be dangerous to cyclists. I wrote about this a few months back when the idea first came out: http://cityrestorationmanual.tumblr.com/post/23265620250/offering-cycling-amenities-on-routes-that-cyclists
Those complaining of the city improving neighborhoods because they are (mostly) rich ignore sound infrastructure elsewhere. The Dunsimuir bike lane, Carral St. Greenway (a seperated bike lane that went in with little fuss because there were no wealthy residents or powerful businesses to go NIMBY), traffic calming in Mt. Pleasany/Grandview-Woodland… I could go on. I’m glad to see neighborhoods getting livable streets in this city, even in places where I can’t afford the rent.
25 ThinkOutsideABox // Oct 3, 2012 at 4:38 pm
I also agree with Brian, however on another note, I don’t see the point in creating separated bike lanes and changing traffic patterns along Comox and yet the city is about to spend (millions?) doing so in 2013 as a proposed “greenway”.
There is little traffic on Comox to begin with west of Bute. The Nelson slopes are not an easy climb up towards downtown from Stanley Park. Barclay is a much easier slope to cycle back up.
26 Anne M // Oct 3, 2012 at 5:24 pm
@ThinkOutsideABox I agree with you on the Comox proposal.
27 Glissando Remmy // Oct 3, 2012 at 5:26 pm
Thought of The Day
“Rhinoceros live in Vancouver and Vision keeps Rhinoceros busy!”
See what’s going on in here?
You have all become actors in an Eugene Ionesco play! Theater of the Absurd.
You’ve just been baptized (me included).
We are the newest Rhinoceros of Vancouver.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tYgR1Pb-lk4&feature=related
Like in one of those plays where the public is engaged to the point that they become the … main subject of the play.
Don’t laugh. I’m talking about you!
So, this is what Vision does. Nothing!
Yup, they do nothing!
They go to work day in day out, and do… nothing.
After four years in office, I’ll be damned if I could point to a single real good deed that came out of their administration.
None.
Their MO – modus operandi?
Take something that’s good, that works well, that’s not broken and then… screw with it.
Then lay back, relax and watch the whole city… go to panic!
That must be some sick entertainment, but hey, it is entertainment!
They threw a few bony ideas now and then, apparently trying to look busy, let’s check them out…
YESTERDAY…
- Mayor’s Task Force on West End Tenants;
- Mayor’s Task Force on Homelessness (Street/Park/Bodega/All Seasons…);
- Mayor’s Task Force on Oil Tankers;
- Mayor’s Task Force on Shark Fin Soup;
TODAY…
- Mayor’s Task Force on Housing Affordability;
TOMORROW…
- Mayor’s Task Force on Neighborliness… Togetherness, Loneliness, and Huginess…
What’s next?
Mayor’s Task Force on…
Grandma Activated Traffic Lights OR
Neighbor on Neighbor Reporting OR
CCTV Surveillance On Non Compliance To Greenness…?
I could go on and on.
Bike lanes on Point Grey Road.
Give it a month or two.
Meanwhile… what’s in it for them?
Another day another buck!
We live in Vancouver and this keep us busy.
28 gasp // Oct 3, 2012 at 6:06 pm
The westbound route along Cornwall/Point Grey road is the main traffic artery used by residents who live west of Alma in West Point Grey and UBC. Rerouting all those cars to 4th Avenue, which already has stop and go traffic, isn’t necessary (or “green”).
It seems to me that it would be a much less costly, contentious, and reasonable compromise to move the bike route to West 1st Avenue, especially west of MacDonald where 1st and Cornwall are a few metres apart.
29 John Geddes // Oct 3, 2012 at 6:12 pm
A simple solution for bikes is to ride on 1st. I do it all the time. Why anyone rides on the western end of Cornwall is beyond me.
And for the eastern end of Cornwall there are equally safe alternatives around the pool and thru Kits Point that avoid all traffic dangers. Again I have used them for years.
OK Peter L. you cannot ride your road bike at 30km/hr on the routes I am describing but I don’t believe that is the bike rider profile that we are trying to protect. Fast riders need fast streets which is a different issue altogether.
30 waltyss // Oct 3, 2012 at 6:45 pm
@gasp. That is simply not true largely because Pt Grey Road is a hazard to drive particularly west of Macdonald. Far more people take 4th Avenue. To call Pt. Grey Road a main traffic artery is a joke. It is a convenience for drivers (like me) who take it notwithstanding the cyclists and the fact that it has no traffic lights after Macdonald.
@Glissy. you are starting to repeat. No, that’s nto true; you started to repeat a long time ago. Same old, same old.
31 Richard // Oct 3, 2012 at 8:05 pm
@gasp
Only problem is that there is no 1st Ave from just west of Macdonald to Trutch. Point Grey really is the only direct option. 1st east of Macdonald is really hilly. This is why many people cycle on Cornwall and Point Grey. There is no way to make 1st more direct and less hilly short of bulldozing the hill and several buildings. I suspect that isn’t going to gain much support anywhere. Much cheaper and less controversy to just to build separate on bike lanes on Cornwall and divert the traffic off Point Grey.
32 teririch // Oct 3, 2012 at 9:40 pm
I had posted replies to both waltyss and Richard – they went to moderation and never made it through s0:
Responding to waltyss #18:
I have lived in Kits and the area being discussed for over 20 years now and am extremely familiar with the traffic patterns of the area. And as an FYI – I take the bus to work, everyday catching it at Macdonald and W 4th so please don’t lecture me on who tansit operates in the area.
If they are discussing ‘walling off’ Point Grey Road from Macodnald to Alma in order to provide a bike lane, then there has to be a connector – and forgive me and others who leap to the ‘idea’ that Cornwall would be the first otpion as it directly connects to the Burrard St. Bridge. That means removing a traffic lane in one direction or the other, which will directly impact the bus route and ALL the people (and I would venture there are a heck of a lot more people taking the bus that biking). If it is suggested that there be only one lane heading either west-east or east-west, then that lane will be a mess during the morning commute. Traffic is heavy during rush time to begin with.
I would recheck your ‘facts’ on the impact of the bike lanes on both Hornby and Dunsmuir as to state that there was no impact is false. The businesses lost revenue. So to say that W 4th, that seems to already struggle would not be impacted is wrong.
Funny, once you can’t argue facts, you seem to go after the poster – seems to be your MO.
And the exsiting bike lane is on West 3rd, not W 1 or 2.
33 teririch // Oct 3, 2012 at 10:06 pm
@#Richard #19:
The buses on Cornwall run without issue as there are parking restrictions attached to the outside lanes.
So, if you take away one lane – it will impact traffic and slow it.
Again I ask, what happens to the bus stops on the effected lane?
Just as a side note – 20+ years of traveling the area and I’ve yet to be tied up due to a ‘collision’.
The only time that I was stuck was due to Critical Mass holding their ‘tea’ party on the Burrard Street Bridge on a Friday long-weekend and screwing those that were trying to get home at the end of a long work day. Traffic was tied up all the way up Burrard, West 4th and the side streets in both directions. Traffic was a mess – cars sat idling (now that is green, isn’t it?)
And judging by those 20 – 30 persons particpating in Critical Mass – work is a foreign word to them.
They serve your cause well.
34 Chris Keam // Oct 3, 2012 at 10:21 pm
Critical Mass, whatever you may think of it, causes some minor traffic congestion once a month. Single occupant vehicles cause traffic congestion twice daily. Add in an inattentive driver and a crash and thousands of people are inconvenienced. Listen to the traffic reports. Invariably the worst congestion is in places where people aren’t cycling. Perspective. Let’s have some.
35 Richard // Oct 3, 2012 at 10:24 pm
@teririch
Hornby and Dunsmuir are totally different streets with totally different businesses. To say the results for businesses on 4th would be similar is a real stretch to say the least. If the businesses are struggling without bike lanes on the street, why not give them a try and see if it helps. I have the feeling the biggest part of the problem is not enough people in walking distance. There are a lot more people in cycling distance. With so many people in Kits and Point Grey that cycle, I suspect a bike lane would be good for many businesses.
The real problem for buses all around the city is too many cars get in their way. Already in Kits, almost 10% of residents cycle to work. Separated bike lanes on Cornwall would increase that number significantly getting more cars out of the way of the buses.
There is no “bike lane” on 3rd. It is just a regular street with a few bike route signs slapped up. With parking, it is uncomfortably narrow to pass on-coming vehicles on a bike.
36 Chris Keam // Oct 3, 2012 at 10:25 pm
Advice for those stuck in traffic and concerned about their greenhouse gas impacts.
http://www.consumerenergycenter.org/myths/idling.html
37 Joe Just Joe // Oct 3, 2012 at 11:27 pm
Curious if 10% of the people in Kits do cycle to work now, Can we dig up how many cycled to work before the Burrard bridge lane? How about before the Hornby lane? Can we show correlation that the percentage has increased and will increase again if this new lane is built?
38 jenables // Oct 4, 2012 at 1:44 am
Richard, if ten percent of people living in kits cycle (that’s not what i see) then why do they need so much on street parking? They keep giving residents more and more even though there has been no new zoning. Residents of the 2100 block west fifth already had either underground or building (“alley”) parking but still needed on street parking..making me think they have more than one vehicle per household? I certainly don’t see one in ten on bikes, especially not in the fall and winter.
39 Chris Keam // Oct 4, 2012 at 8:11 am
“if ten percent of people living in kits cycle (that’s not what i see) then why do they need so much on street parking?”
Cuz they’re leaving their cars at home all day!
40 Richard // Oct 4, 2012 at 8:14 am
@jenables
The cycling commuting stats are from Statscan. Many of the cars seemed to be parked most of the time meaning that many people don’t use there car that much and likely get around by walking, cycling and transit reserving the car for weekend getaways or trips to Costco.
People tend not to notice cyclists because they don’t take up as much space as a car.
41 Agustin // Oct 4, 2012 at 10:10 am
@ Richard, “People tend not to notice cyclists because they don’t take up as much space as a car.”
I think another reason is that cyclists purposely go on streets where there are fewer cars.
I’ve certainly noticed that I see more cyclists when I’m cycling than I do when I’m driving
42 Richard // Oct 4, 2012 at 11:10 am
Some interesting research on cycling and business.
From:
http://m.portlandmercury.com/portland/bike-business/Content?oid=7150027
BUSINESSES SOMETIMES line up against bike projects because they worry building out bike lanes will hinder their customers who arrive by car.
But a Portland State University study finds that cyclists are often more valuable customers: People who arrive at bars, restaurants, and convenience stores by bike spend more money than people who come by car, by transit, or on foot.
43 brilliant // Oct 4, 2012 at 11:12 am
This is a classic Vision ploy-deliver a nice freebie to existing and potential well-heeled doors on Pt Grey Rd and spray a gallon if greenwash on it. The sensible thing would be to remove a parking lane.
44 Brian // Oct 4, 2012 at 11:20 am
@John – #27
Why shouldn’t we be protecting cyclists trying to get where they’re going in a timely manner? Making routes quicker increases the utility of cycling by increasing cyclists’ mobility. Regardless of one’s fitness level or riding style, having less stops, flatter grades, and more direct routes increases a cyclists’ speed, range, and comfort which makes cycling more useful and more attractive.
45 West End Gal // Oct 4, 2012 at 12:02 pm
Road closures in favor of biking. Classic Vision Vancouver. Catering to Developers, now to the Rich. Well done.
46 teririch // Oct 4, 2012 at 12:24 pm
@Richard #33:
Again, the buses have zero issue on Cornwall now – due to restrictive parking zones.
So how do you figure that taking out a car lane, and replacing it with a bike lane is going to impove the tranist time?
And again, where do the bus stops on the effected lane move to???
47 teririch // Oct 4, 2012 at 12:28 pm
@Richard #33
Didn’t the VACC create a Facebook page asking/suggesting their ‘membership’ to shop at the effected storefronts on Hornby and Dunsmuir in order to help with their revenue losses and well lets face it, try and fix the optics?
Taking away parking from a destination shop area makes no sense, and West 4th is a destination shop/eat area.
48 Craig // Oct 4, 2012 at 1:00 pm
Why doesn’t city council do something about CNR line which runs from Fraser River through west side of the city to Granville island. I haven’t talked to one person directly or indirectly affected that doesn’t agree that this would be a great bike/walking route. Instead they run around trying to grab headlines instead of concrete proposals that may actually have an impact. Old and very young people don’t bike on 3rd b/c of the hills … really?!? Last time I checked there wasn’t a lot of housing at the end of the road unless you ride up a significant hill to UBC, W Pt Grey or Dunbar. Most of the people I know who do ride to work are “cyclists” and only ride when the weather is dry.
How about this? 7 months (Ap-Oct) one lane of traffic 12 midnight until noon running east so people can get to work and noon until midnight west.
49 Sean Nelson // Oct 4, 2012 at 1:17 pm
@Craig #46: “Why doesn’t city council do something about CNR line which runs from Fraser River through west side of the city to Granville island.”
Because it’s private property owned by CP Rail and Vancouver doesn’t have the power to do what it wants with it. Vancouver has, however, designated it as a transportation corridor which at least put zoning restrictions in place that prevented CP from developing it as condos.
50 Tessa // Oct 4, 2012 at 1:29 pm
teririch 31
There’s a bus stop along the separated bike lane on Dunsmuir Street near Cambie that operates perfectly fine. The bike lane is raised and there are zebra stripes to indicate a pedestrian crossing, and there is a strip of pedestrian space on the street-side of the bike lane. If you don’t understand how this works, I encourage you to go look at it.
Aside from that, there are literally thousands of bus stops along bike lanes in Europe. The city where I’m currently staying has plenty, and I’ve never seen a serious conflict. Bus stops are easily accommodated and in fact are routine, so it’s nothing to get worked up about.
51 Joe Just Joe // Oct 4, 2012 at 1:41 pm
On Dunsmuir there are additional thru lanes though, if you attempt to do that on a one laned street then all traffic behind the bus stops with the bus.
52 teririch // Oct 4, 2012 at 1:56 pm
@ Tessa #31:
I fully understand how it ‘works’ But if you only have two lanes traveling in one direction and you take one away – that leaves one, for all traffic flowing in that direction to use
This is what will happen on Cornwall.
There are 2 lanes each direction. During rush hour, parking restrictions are in play so the buses flow freely,
If you take away one of the lanes in either direction that means traffic shares one lane (either west-east or east – west)
And this is Vancouver – not Europe, Portland, Montreal etc.
We are unique unto our own.
53 waltyss // Oct 4, 2012 at 3:05 pm
@teririch:
And this is Vancouver – not Europe, Portland, Montreal etc.
We are unique unto our own.
What does that mean? We can’t look at what works elsewhere because we are so unique? Really? Based on what?
54 Richard // Oct 4, 2012 at 3:21 pm
@teririch
During evenings and weekends, there is parking along Cornwall. One lane each direction seems to work fine. Commercial Drive north of 1st is the same. Vehicles will go slower which is safer for everyone including drivers, walkers, transit users and cyclists. Crashes down by 19% on Hornby after separated bike lanes installed.
55 Richard // Oct 4, 2012 at 3:26 pm
Businesses can also take advantage of bike lanes. This jewelry shop on Hornby has a matching beautiful bike parked out front. Great advertising.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/A4ZPwW1CQAAFk3_.jpg
56 MB // Oct 4, 2012 at 3:48 pm
The thought of the month.
All people who live near and travel on Point Grey Road by whatever mode of transport obviously value being near the water. In my opinion, the waterfront should be accessible to the public as a general principle, but the property owners on the north side of PG Rd started building their expensive houses to the high water mark seemingly eons ago and beat the public and their elected representatives to the punch.
With the resulting exorbitant prices, it’s no wonder the Park Board has only been able to afford purchase one lot at a time (at street ends) and to punch only six small parks through to the bluff in the 1.5 km stretch between Trafalgar and Alma so far.
John Geddes (27) proposed a viable alternative route for cyclists on 1st Ave. It’s already partially there on the Vancouver Cycling Map, but limited to the stretch between Fir and Cypress. This route should be extended to McDonald where it intersects with PG Rd.
A better route (albeit farther from the waterfront) is Third Ave, which offers a straight-line from Granville Island to Jericho. Again, it’s only a partial route (Trafalgar to Jericho) and should be extended east to Granville Island with all the attendant cyclist-pedestrian activated lights, traffic circles, signs, etc.
But it’s debatable that either route will attract cyclists away from PG Rd and address the conflicts with cars and pedestrians.
The Case for the Kitsilano Pier
Just recently the issue of building a seawall on the shore below the gazillionaire’s houses came up and was controversial from day one. Even though there may not be red-listed plant or marine life on the rocky beach there, I believe a Stanley Park-like seawall structure would be an inappropriate alteration to the beach itself, which should be left in its natural state.
However, if a pier was built out in the water parallel to the beach, with its two ends connecting to the foot of Balsam and Alma, and if it was wide enough to accommodate both bikes and pedestrians (8-10m? raised pedestrian platform for separation from bikes?), then I’d bet tomorrow’s morning Canadiano that thousands of people on foot and on bikes would vacate PG Rd. for the opportunity to actually get out over the water on a major pier. If the pier ran in a straight line, it would be about 1.8km long and about 230 meters out in the ocean from inside curve of the shoreline at Volunteer Park just west of McDonald. And I’d bet tomorrow’s second cup that it would offer a faster route for people on foot and bikes from the Kits Beach to Hastings Mill Park + Jericho than the road.
Some will argue that a pier parallel to the shore would be a visual intrusion, especially for the mega-rich. Well, it would essentially appear as a thin horizontal line on stilts … quite light on the land /water … and be far less intrusive than a heavy seawall. Jacqui Cohen’s opinion is only one of thousands in the neighbourhood anyway.
On the other hand, some, like me, would suggest the pier idea should be expanded with another adjoining pier that would extend perpendicular from the shore (from Balsam?) and a lot further into the ocean (200-300m?) and be wide enough (12-15m?) to accommodate hundreds of pedestrians with seating, shade / rain shelters, food carts, a small performance stage, educational signs, power and water, etc.
I’ve been on the Santa Cruz, Ca., pier and was blown away at what an amazing and popular public amenity it is. It’s always packed. There are even railed off cutouts in the decking to allow people to observe sea lions sleeping on the timbers just below. There is new evidence that piers using inert (i.e. concrete or steel) piles and decking offering substantial shade creates habitat for herring to deposit their roe. Herring are an important food source for a lot of our marine life, including salmon, whales and seals.
Anyway, with the great possibility that pedestrian and bike traffic could be drawn off the road by an attractive major pier project (that also happens to protect the intregrity of the natural beach), then Point Grey Rd. could be modified to allow more pedestrian crossings – but beef them up, add signals and raise them into level “speed bumps” to literally slow the traffic down with something more effective than just signs.
57 Silly Season // Oct 4, 2012 at 3:52 pm
Oooh, @MB. That is a cool idea.
Engineers, is it viable?
Who “owns” that waterway? Prov? Feds? City?
58 MB // Oct 4, 2012 at 4:42 pm
@ Silly, judging from my one and only sailing boat experience in English Bay, the water is quite shallow even 500m out (consistently ~30 ft deep way out to the edge of the sand bank) so depth shouldn’t be a huge issue.
The parallel-to-shore pier could be kinked to follow the shoreline more closely if there are deep bottom pockets, but having drawn a 1.8km line connecting Hastings Mill Park @ Alma to Kits Beach Park @ Balsam on Google Earth, it’s obvious a straight line would be very dramatic as the shoreline curves away over 200m to the south at the middle. People would get a true sense of being over the water, and I’d bet storms would attract lots of people to the pier as the structure gets pounded.
So yes, sound engineering is necessary. The Santa Cruz and San Diego piers both extend into the pounding surf of the open Pacific. I loved feeling the SD pier rock with each 15-foot roller crashing below it. There might be 6-footers in English Bay by comparison.
This is ultimately federal jurisdiction (DFO has laws …) and an environmental assessment wil have to be conducted with perhaops some habitat compensation negotiated elsewhere. The province accepts applications for water leases for private docks all the time.
There’s a certain delight in pile drivers operating offshore from the play houses of the rich for a few weeks.
The environmental impact of a pier is more than likely orders of magnitude less than a concrete and fill seawall, so the primary issue may get down to cost. My guess it will be in the low tens of millions, but then so will a seawall.
Perhaps Jacqui would willingly make a large enough donation to get her name on the pier — and the riff raff away from her driveway.
59 Higgins // Oct 4, 2012 at 6:29 pm
MB #56 Isn’t Jacqui the Vancouver Hilton socialite that ordered 3-4 dozens of trees to be cut in front of her property… to recapture “views”?
What did she get for that… if I remember correctly … nothing. Now these “civic leaders” get their own private road… WOW!
60 Informed // Oct 4, 2012 at 7:39 pm
Most interesting reading my fellow residents’ ponderings, concerns and suggestions for solving the Point Grey Road traffic conundrum. Might I offer though that attending one or more of the numerous on-going public meetings on the subject would prevent many of the fears and misstatements that I have read above from you. You would be kept up-to-date on the planning and proposal procedure and would be involved in the input that would generate decision-making. In particular, your personal stories about incidents on Point Grey Road and Cornwall are invaluable to the solution process, and I encourage you to attend meetings and send your stories to City Hall and the Transportation Plan 2040 Committee.
61 Informed // Oct 4, 2012 at 8:15 pm
Not everyone living on Point Grey Road is a Gazillionaire — far from it, in fact. There is a Grand Canyon divide in assets between those living on the South versus the North side of Point Grey Road. Further, from attending meetings, I can tell you that the primary concern of residents living on BOTH sides of Point Grey Road is SAFETY of pedestrians, cyclists, drivers, pets, and vehicles that use this secondary arterial. The ancient designation of this road as a main thoroughfare has ultimately reached its critical mass of contending users, resulting in maiming, vehicular damage and deaths. An entirely residential area with parks and beach foreshore is incongruous with a major thoroughfare. The City has now acknowledged their awareness of this reality, so the City (the taxpayers) will be on the hook for multi-million dollar personal injury lawsuits until the problem of Point Grey Road is rectified. If you are a taxpayer, I recommend that you get on board to support a viable solution.
62 Chris Keam // Oct 4, 2012 at 9:21 pm
You know Higgins, I don’t agree with Ms Cohen’s actions, but honestly, it takes a few seconds to do some due diligence to learn the exact number of trees cut down and how much of a fine she paid. So, instead of relying on the hope you remember ‘correctly’ why not actually do the legwork to provide relatively accurate information instead of sharing incorrect junk opinions?
63 Chris Keam // Oct 4, 2012 at 9:25 pm
oh yeah, 35 trees, $50,000 fine. Wrong times two Higgins. Took me about a minute to highlight your slapdash approach to other people’s poor choices. You should have checked your facts before you posted. You wouldn’t have to apologize for spreading bad information. Cause you are going to grace us all with a mea culpa right?
64 Informed // Oct 4, 2012 at 9:50 pm
MB: Point Grey Road is a designated emergency vehicle route (St. Paul’s Hospital on Burrard Street, just across the bridge) — speed bumps aren’t a viable option, and packing people onto a pier means only more traffic; ummm, SAFETY is the issue here, people.
65 Glissando Remmy // Oct 4, 2012 at 11:31 pm
Thought of The Night
” Aren’t they… Vision Vancouver & Mayor Gregor the COPY/PASTE darlings of the day? Someone’s Eco Density is Someone’s Vision Shmensity!”
Waltyss, you say #28:
“@Glissy. you are starting to repeat. No, that’s nto true; you started to repeat a long time ago. Same old, same old.”
Thanks for that. Fair enough.
So, watzzuup!?
Mayor’s Task Force on Housing Affordability Report… stop the presses!
Enter the… Eco Density Prince, followed by his Vision Shmensity Mistress …
All I see is a revamping of the old Eco Density plans, under a new headline.
Ten months of minuet, curtsies and classical ballet, and now they bring in a Maurice Bejart choreography, oh please!
Look around you. Please, do it for me.
Go back and forth on Kingsway, Broadway, Arbutus… and tell me what you see.
Yes, buildings just like those proposed in the new Report. Gee, how did they think of that?
Perhaps because some Developers were already ahead of the pack on that, hmmm, go figure.
Thing is, it was happening already, at a normal pace, and it will go at the same pace in the future, just wait. We are not China, to build a hotel in 9 days… for the record.
Anyways.
All is well when it Endswell… right?
I am glad that they colored the Vancouver map in assorted shades of Crayola crayons but nowhere in that report I found any reference what-so-ever, on how are all this goodies going to affect or solve… AFFORDABILITY!
Wasn’t that, what the Task Force was charged with “solving”… Housing Affordability?
‘Cause I still don’t see it.
I know that the Rental Assistance Program (a Vision baby) makes sure the Landlord gets… PAID on time…
Now, I see that… The Developers are taken care of, and they can breath at ease now, with so much more parcels to develop, and ain’t that, what matters after all… ?
“Same old, same old”, your words, not mine!
Chris K #59
Allow me to provide a link to the story:
“In 2005, businesswoman and socialite Jacqui Cohen agreed to pay $50,000 plus court costs to the Greater Vancouver Regional District to settle a lawsuit filed over 34 trees cut without a permit in front of her family’s former mansion in 1997.”
http://www.canada.com/vancouversun/news/westcoastnews/story.html?id=f36145b1-9f28-40fb-9c47-84c68936c3e6
LOL, did you read this?
“At the time, Cohen said she had no knowledge of or involvement in the destruction of the trees, but agreed to take responsibility.”
Which reminds me of a great dialogue from the “Shawshank Redemption” movie:
“Red: You’re gonna fit right in. Everyone in here is innocent, you know that? Heywood, what you in here for?
Heywood: Didn’t do it. Lawyer f%#&*ed me.”
Great movie!
We live in Vancouver and this keeps us busy.
66 gasp // Oct 5, 2012 at 2:15 am
Glissy – thank you very much; you made my night with your view on EcoDensity squared (or is it cubed?). I thought it was just EcoDensity on steroids!
Anyway, I notice that real estate sales are crashing while listings are ballooning, so it’s perfect timing for an “affordable housing strategy”. I think its effect will be to accelerate the bursting of this bubble by encouraging more retiring boomers to pack up and leave the City sooner rather than later, as they’ve been doing since EcoDensity effectively gave the developers the opportunity to ruin the character of every neighbourhood in this City without any meaningful public consultation or “fair” public rezoning hearings.
And, of course, the net result of a housing crash will be … “affordable housing”. Vision’s goal accomplished, just in time for the next election!
67 Tessa // Oct 5, 2012 at 2:34 am
“There are 2 lanes each direction. During rush hour, parking restrictions are in play so the buses flow freely,
If you take away one of the lanes in either direction that means traffic shares one lane (either west-east or east – west)”
So…like Commercial Drive north of 1st Avenue. Like Pender Street in Chinatown. These streets and many others work fine. If cars have to wait 10 seconds for people to board then cars have to wait. It’s a five-block section with two bus stops after all, and maybe bus pull-outs could even be accommodated with some creativity.
“And this is Vancouver – not Europe, Portland, Montreal etc.
We are unique unto our own.”
Trust me – mediocre planning isn’t unique to Vancouver.
But I really don’t know what you mean by this. If you’re saying Vancouver can never learn from other jurisdictions, that’s horribly wrong. That kind of provincial approach that says we can’t ever try anything that is proven to work without any trouble in other countries does no good for the city.
68 Chris Keam // Oct 5, 2012 at 8:03 am
GR:
Don’t give a fig what Cohen said. It’s anonymous jackasses that throw out vitriolic comments that are erroneous that chap my hide, esp. when the facts are easily obtained. But I can understand why you wouldn’t want online accountability to become a trend given the tone and nature of most of your ‘contributions’.
CK
69 Glissando Remmy // Oct 5, 2012 at 9:48 am
CK #66,
All I did there was to provide a link to the original story, which you didn’t, just like Higgins.
BTW, that was simply a FWIW info. kind of thing.
Off topic anyways.
I liked your “anonymous jackasses” … expression! Not bad. Very smart.
I don’t provide ‘contributions’ Chris, I say it how I see it, more like personal ‘views’.
(Got glasses?)
My ‘views’ don’t affect parking fee increases, real estate prices, development or housing affordability, but the people I’m ‘viewing’… do!
Just trying to keep them honest, that’s all.
To my chagrin, I’m failing at that.
I feel your pain… Chris, there is something you should know about me… my ‘views’ seem to make some people happy, that’s all I’m about, and… I understand!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_QK9_Jzq0wA
Hey, here’s what I propose, if they change the name from ‘Mayor’s Task Force on Housing Affordability” to “Mayor’s Task Force on More Subtle Development” I’d give up.
I couldn’t possibly fight against a group of honest folks, just couldn’t!
GR
70 Richard // Oct 5, 2012 at 10:30 am
More on how bikes help business and the economy:
http://www.fastcoexist.com/1680611/bikes-arent-just-good-for-you-theyre-good-for-the-economy-too
71 Paul T. // Oct 5, 2012 at 2:41 pm
Frances, I take issue with you pronouncing this council as “bike-lane-friendly”… This council has not made nearly as much headway in building bikelanes as any council before them. Call a spade a spade.. This council is “anti-car”. Gregor and his merry band won’t consider a bike lane unless it involves taking away either parking or a travel lane. The turfing of the plan to expand the sea wall is a perfect example. It’s unused land that could be enjoyed by thousands. But they won’t touch it because it doesn’t involve inconveniencing drivers.
And as for the comment about the lack of effect on business by the Hornby Street bike track, clearly you haven’t taken a walk down Hornby Street. The only new business that has arrived has been the Royal Bank at Hornby and Nelson. And they’re only there temporarily while the current branch at Howe and Nelson is demolished.
72 spartikus // Oct 5, 2012 at 4:44 pm
-Brent Toderian.
73 Richard // Oct 5, 2012 at 5:38 pm
@69Paul T.
Might want to take another look on Hornby. Sciué is opening soon in the HSBC building, glowbal has opened a cafe next to the Salt development, the food court next to Vancity has renovated and reopened, there is the jewelry shop across from the Wall Centre who have a matching bike outside, Musette Cafe, a new hair salon and, the lemonade stand run by two girls across from the Wall Centre. Also two condo developments going up. Only one for lease sign. All and all, it certainly seems like a healthy street where businesses are starting to take advantage of the opportunities offered by the bike lanes.
When life gives you bike lanes, make lemonade or coffee and baked goods.
74 Ned // Oct 6, 2012 at 1:57 pm
“When life gives you bike lanes, make lemonade or coffee and baked goods.”
No Richard,
Life didn’t give us bike lanes, some were there already (since immemorial NPA times)! No Richard, life shoved separated bike lanes down our throats, and I’d likely make vodka lemonades with them instead.
A Paul T. said previously
“This council is “anti-car”. Gregor and his merry band won’t consider a bike lane unless it involves taking away either parking or a travel lane. ”
Quite right!
75 jenables // Oct 6, 2012 at 2:17 pm
Richard, my point actually was that the residents already had places to park their unused cars. The block in question is mostly apartments, no new developments, and the apartments already have secure underground or behind the building parking. Apparently this isn’t enough, because most of the street is now for residents as well. So you can see why I might think they have more than one vehicle per household, or else this is an uncalled for and spiteful decision, right?
76 Richard // Oct 6, 2012 at 10:45 pm
@Ned
Bike lanes on Cornwall and Point Grey have been planned “since immemorial NPA times”. Or specifically, the 1997 Transportation Plan as we’re lanes on Burrard, Granville and Cambie Bridges.
Unfortunately, the painted bike lanes on Hornby and Burrard “since immemorial NPA times” were not that safe. Burrard had pretty much the highest levels of bicycle collisions in the city. All collisions including cars and peds are down 19% on Hornby after the separated lanes were installed. I’m sure you will agree that safety is more important than parking or lanes of traffic, right? Especially where there is tons of underground parking on Hornby and the impact on traffic is minimal.
77 Richard // Oct 6, 2012 at 10:51 pm
@jenables
People with money buy stuff. That does not mean they use it all the time. Around 60% of people in Vancouver own bikes. Obviously though, 60% of trips are not by bike. Same with cars. Many people bike to work a lot of the time and use their cars only on the weekends are for shopping.
The Netherlands has one of the highest rates of car ownership in Europe yet between 30 and 40% of trips cities are by bike.
78 jenables // Oct 7, 2012 at 12:30 am
Ok, I’m aware of the not using everything you own at every moment way of life, i think most people who don’t have all their worldly possesions in a bindle know what you mean. But we are digressing, no? I was wondering why such avid cyclists as those in kits would need the street parking in addition to the parking already provided to them. Maybe they felt like spending money…on a residential permit? Just because they can?
79 teririch // Oct 7, 2012 at 2:47 pm
@jenables #76
Kits is very much a place of shared accomodation due to university being close and the lifestyle it offers to people of all ages. Many of the houses are mulit-person/family dwellings. It is typical that one house may have 3 – 4 living units – but more than likely parking for one or two vehicles, max.
So if there is only one parking spot alloted to one unit – it makes sense that any other vehicles are parked ont he street.
My apartment building has one parking spot per unit. One of my neighbors – a couple, have two vehicles. He was parking on the street. As I don’t currently own a car, I offered my space to him.
If you walk around the neighborhood, you will see many of the side streets are residential permit parking. Cornwall is one of the few street that is still open to all and note metred. It all also serves those local eateries like ‘Local’ that has minimal parking on its lot.
80 jenables // Oct 7, 2012 at 2:48 pm
Ps -people use cars for shopping? I was told eliminating parking was BETTER for business because cyclists spend more money! Maybe they meant cyclists, when they drive spent more money. Huh.
81 jenables // Oct 7, 2012 at 3:05 pm
Teririch- i know what you mean, the block I’m referring to is 2100 west fifth, they have made it mostly residential and the rest is 2 hour, and you can see that it wasn’t needed judging by the emptiness of the permit parking. The two hour parking is often full, this pushes traffic up towards the school, i have seen numerous accidents involving cars crossing arbutus, I’ve even seen a pedestrian killed a few years ago. Given that cars will not be vanishing from west forth anytime soon, unless everyone goes out of business, you can expect the surrounding blocks to have more vehicular traffic. Fact of life, right? So why is it that the residents feel it is their God given right to park however many vehicles on The street in addition to the parking they already have, at the expense of the safety of others and the businesses who have all had a HUGE property tax increase? Is it that awful to have to walk a block or two when its a multiple vehicle household and the other car has the good spot?
82 David // Oct 7, 2012 at 5:34 pm
I lived in a 1912 era house on 7th Ave in Kits for almost two decades. 7 units, similar houses on either side. Very little parking (my building had one spot), and this part of Kitsilano doesn’t have rear lanes. Driveways accessed from the street.
Constantly occupied on street parking probably was a ‘good thing’ safety wise, there was only one lane for travel, when two cars met one had to yield in a curb cut . Speeds? Low. Even 30km/h seemed ‘too fast’ .
83 jenables // Oct 7, 2012 at 10:26 pm
yes, there are no alleys, but in this particular case, there are only two or three houses, and every other building has the parking built in. The area you were in David, I think is also where the bike route is, right? I agree, more traffic in that area is not desirable… but that’s where people end up if they can’t park close to where they are going, right? Anyways, I don’t mean to go off about fourth and fifth when the original post was about… point grey!!
84 Creeker // Oct 8, 2012 at 1:02 pm
Bike lane on Point Grey road? Yes!
Turning Point Grey road (a major commuter arterial) into a gated community? Hell no!
When most owners on Point Grey bought, they knew it was a very busy street. There is no justifiable reason for closing this major traffic artery.
85 David W. // Oct 11, 2012 at 4:51 pm
I’m a late arrival to this topic, but west 4th is already a virtual parking lot during peak times. There are times when it’s actually faster to take the #22 bus and stop every block along Cornwall for a bus stop, red light or both, than it is to take the #44 express along 4th. Shifting even more traffic to 4th would be a disaster for everyone: residents, merchants and anyone trying to get somewhere.
I remember when the playground signs went up along Pt. Grey Road. To this day the explanation I give visitors is: “it’s a playground for the rich”.
Now I’m not advocating we go back to Tom Terrific’s plans to tear down everything along Pt. Grey Road to make way for a 6-lane, high speed, Chicago style “parkway”, but surely anyone with an IQ above their shoe size can see it’s the logical route for a lot of Point Grey/Dunbar/Kits traffic to get downtown. If you bought property there expecting the traffic to go away then you’re an idiot.
86 teririch // Oct 13, 2012 at 11:09 am
Funny, just read that for a second year in a row, Vancouver has been voted most conjested when it comes to traffic.
We stand behind…Los Angeles.
The average ‘rush’ hour commute time has increased by 69%.
But hey, more separated bike lanes and removing the viaducts will help that number….increase. Maybe we can take that number #1 spot yet!
87 Frances Bula // Oct 13, 2012 at 4:19 pm
@Teri. You seem to know the city pretty well. So you must realize that the vast majority of the congestion in the region (which is what the traffic study looked at) is not in Vancouver, but in the outlying areas. Anyone who lives in Vancouver knows that it’s actually pretty easy to get around in, except for about 30 minutes in the morning and evening on a handful of streets. Almost none of which have bike lanes.
88 teririch // Oct 14, 2012 at 1:37 pm
@Frances”
Fair point.
I can only speak to the line-ups I see merging south onto the Burrard Bridge and Hornby Street during rush.
Right now with construction of the youth home on Burrard, things aren’t great along there for nothbound traffic during rush, either.
But, the removal of the viaducts are going to bring new commute issues for a lot of people that use that route to come into the city for work.
89 Catch22 // Oct 20, 2012 at 8:13 am
Point Grey Road is dangerous to ride on a bike. I’ve done it many times. It is also a natural cycling route to UBC. Therefore I support making Point Grey road “one way” for cars and using the other lane for bicycles. It is far more sensible than putting lanes on Fourth Ave, which is an important commercial hub that needs its parking spots.
90 Higgins // Oct 20, 2012 at 3:29 pm
Catch 22 #89
Actually I like your idea.
How can I put it … it’s catchy!
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