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Vancouver looks to create a new office district around stadiums, which developers and brokers say is going to be a tough sell at first

July 31st, 2012 · 16 Comments

Besides building a lot of rental units around the Rogers Arena, the Aquilini empire is also being required to put in 200,000 square feet of office space as part of the city’s drive to create new “job space” downtown.

Nearby Canadian Metropolitan Properties is also going to have to build a whack of office if it wants to get its condos. My story today looks at the ups and downs of creating a new office precinct in an area relatively distant from the central business district.

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  • trixie

    Your G&M article shows a sketch of the new buildings with the old viaducts still in place. Which will come first — buildings up or viaducts down?

  • Frances Bula

    @Trixie. Who knows? Depends on how fast the viaducts decision is made and, as I blogged earlier, the mayor seems to have thrown a little sugar in the engine. My guess is, buildings first, but built to accommodate road re-alignment if viaducts come down.

  • Dan Cooper

    Whatever else, I know at least two people are interested in that lot between the viaducts and the stadium! The other weekend, on my occasional hike down to T&T for frozen dumplings and buns, I noticed two gentlemen in robes and keffiyahs walking around and inside it and making notes. No idea, of course, what their specific role or interests in the project might be.

  • Lewis N. Villegas

    Slam dunk, Frances. The concept of a hub for entertainment & sports is a great start.

    The skytrain is across the street (along with Cosco). The CBC is a 5 minute walk away. Being away from the downtown core is going to be a plus if this concept takes hold.

    It sure would be nice to throw our weight behind this development, and come up with a formula to take down the viaducts and make that walk from the stadia up Georgia something reminiscent of ‘good’ urbanism.

    There are still the Cambie Grounds to account for in the area that some would cede to the Vancouver Art Gallery.

    I would prefer that CG remain as public realm. Maybe the VAG could occupy space in a culture, entertainment,and sports new hub in our city.

  • Frank Ducote

    This is a good move, but I would have been happier if all the allowable floor area in these crammed triangular biits of the arena site had been designated for commercial use, particularly office.

    As sealed building types, and with complementary night time parking availability, commercial/office would have been a much better fit with the transit station and the noisy sports and entertainment activities destined to remain. Residential is an extremely poor use here, but that’s the name of the game in Vancouver. Sigh.

    For those who don’t know, the site with the 4-tower Concord residential development above the nearby Costco was once upon a time earmarked in NEFC plans for commercial use (office, hotel, etc.). That desirable land use right on the corner of Georgia and Beatty Streets was swapped to another Concord site at the north approach to the Cambie Bridge, with residential replacing it, as we now see.

    Office uses generate about a 3:1 ratio of transit trips over residential, on a square foot basis, due to more workers in a given space.

    200,000 sf of office ain’t much, but any move to strengthen Georgia Street as one of our two premier downtown office corridors – along with Burrard Street – makes eminently good sense to me. A little vitality in the daytime is a good thing as well. Again, more would be better.

  • Joe Just Joe

    Agree completely with everything Frank just said. This will be a tough sell at first but since the land cost is close to nil I’m sure Aquilini can offer enticing rates to lure some companies their way.

  • voony

    I second the Frank Ducote’s comment.

    One will also notice that office use balances well the activities in the area (stadium typically fill up, when office are empty).

  • Roger Kemble

    Interesting. After a dearth of office demand over the last thirty years all of a sudden boom, new offices talked about for everywhere.

    After thrashing around to find uses around the stadia compatible with noises emanating from our new . . . errrrr . . . entertainment district . . . the city flies a trial balloon for office zoning as though the work environment is conducive to mayhem.

    Michael G. even suggested airport type windows, by that I assume double glass locked shut, to keep out the noise. At least office windows tight shut will prevent a ’29 type shuffle when the numbers don’t crunch.

    Huh, I live on the tenth floor and I wouldn’t want to be sealed in! And the racket from the park next door is . . . well . . . after twelve years something I have learned to live with.

    But that’s not all. We are also talking about offices at every TX station as a sort of boom in a new form of sprawl.

    What with all the proposed office space does that mean high frequency trading has come to town? Or is it planners’ space to maybe re-plat the city for narrower streets, more ticky-tacky and lots of neighbourhood angst!

    Or is Vancouver in for an industrial epiphany to pay for all the multi-martini lunches?

    This isn’t planning! This is desperation . . .

  • Andrew Browne

    ” blah blah blah whine whine etc”

    “This isn’t planning! This is desperation . . .”

    etc.

    What is wrong with you people? It’s some office space. Near a transit station. The sky is not falling. Not every office needs to be on Burrard!

  • Bill Lee

    Actually, yes it does.
    Offices for junior companies go out to Broadway or, ‘Horrors’ Surrey.

    Offices on Burrard are nearer the Vancouver Club, other head offices or reigional HQs, hotels for nooners etc.

    Besides, concrete and steel last a lifetime are not easily swept away. We may always have a former Ozymandias Aquilini monstrosity inapppropriately placed.

  • Roger Kemble

    Andrew Brown @ #9

    “It’s” just “ some office space. Near a transit station.”

    Yes Andrew and that’s the problem, just more office space near a transit station or just another condo tower near a transit station

    . . . just more ” blah blah blah whine whine etc” over bland concrete towers, or ” blah blah blah whine whine etc” over quite avoidable noise.

    . . . and ” blah blah blah whine whine etc” over what the city considers to be a new Direction: ALIGNING WITH NEFC PLANNING

    http://vancouver.ca/ctyclerk/cclerk/20120724/documents/rr2presentation.pdf

    . . . that repeats the mistake of Pacific Boulevard made thirty years ago.

    City staff doesn’t lack talent. I thinq it is too compliant to apply it! And I doubt, very much, the incoming manager will make a difference!

    There are better ways . . .

    http://members.shaw.ca/urbanismo/la.condessa/la.condesa.html

    . . . La Condesa is called locally, Barrio Magico . . .

    . . . oh how I wish Vancouver had a Barrio Magico.

    Check out Parques San Martin y España and with the three little Gloriettas how together they make up a place so much more than amorphous chunks of green to satisfy the obvious protests.

    Check out the 16 storey Edifice Busarto. Go there! Check out the magical staircase.

    Barrio Magico. And ask yourself, Andrew, why not Vancouver?

  • Guest

    Broadway Tech Park seems to be doing well over on East Broadway. That’s probably the only other large scale office oriented area in Vancouver (other than the downtown penninsula or West Broadway).

    What do people think about the office tower at Oakridge? – it was built in the mid 1980s. I don’t think it’s slated to be demolished in the redevlopment plans (although it could be).

    Otherwise, there are lots of office for engineers and consulting companies in the “light industrial” areas of town like Burrard Slopes.

  • Roger Kemble

    “It’s ” just “ some office space. Near a transit station.”

    Yes Andrew and that’s the problem, just more office space near a transit station or just another condo tower near a transit station . . .

    . . . just more “ blah blah blah whine whine etc” over bland concrete towers, or ” blah blah blah whine whine etc” over quite avoidable noise.
    . . . and ” blah blah blah whine whine etc” over what the city considers to be a new Direction: ALIGNING WITH NEFC PLANNING (click on name above for details) . . . that repeats the mistake of Pacific Boulevard made thirty years ago.
    City staff doesn’t lack talent. I thinq it is too compliant to apply it! And I doubt, very much, the incoming manager will make a difference!
    There are better ways . . .
    http://members.shaw.ca/urbanismo/la.condessa/la.condesa.html
    . . . La Condesa is called locally, Barrio Magico . . .

    . . . oh how I wish Vancouver had a Barrio Magico.

    Check out Parques San Martin y España and with the three little Gloriettas how together they make up a place so much more than amorphous chunks of green to satisfy the obvious protests.

    Check out the 16 storey Edifice Busarto. Go there! Check out the magical staircase.

    Barrio Magico. I wish we had the wit to do one here . . .

  • Terry m

    Roger, Roger,you just back the smile on my face. Thanks! 🙂

  • Terry m

    Geez, that was supposed to be “you … Put back the smile on my face!” 🙂

  • gman

    The APA just released a paper on so called smart growth and it finds its not so smart after all.The density mantra may not be the answer to all our problems after all. http://www2.dailyprogress.com/news/2012/jul/31/smart-growth-not-so-smart-after-all-ar-2097603/