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Laneway housing of a different kind to come to Vancouver’s West End?

November 22nd, 2013 · 40 Comments

Council approved the West End overall plan Wednesday. There was lots of interesting information to mine in that report — the plan for where new towers will go (on the fringes, away from the interior where residents have objected strongly to any new development), the spending plan for new or refurbished community facilities, the little fact that parking has been put back on the main West End streets during rush hours because the space isn’t needed any more for commuters.

But I was intrigued most by the plan to try to add some density in the interior of the neighbourhood by allowing laneway housing — this time, mini-apartment buildings or stacked townhouses — in behind existing towers or low-rise buildings. Can hardly wait to see the first one of those. I wrote my story focusing on that aspect.

 

Laneway housing has proven to be hugely popular in Vancouver’s single-family neighbourhoods in the past few years.

Now the city wants to try the same idea in its oldest downtown neighbourhood, the already dense West End – but with a twist.

Instead of individual residences, the West End would get mini-apartment buildings and stacked townhouses ranging from 3 1/2 to six storeys facing the lanes on available space at the back of existing lots.

That’s one of the more striking ideas in a massive city report going to council on Wednesday that outlines a plan for adding new residents, business space and community services to the area, which became Vancouver’s first dense downtown community in the 1960s and 1970s.

“The lanes in this area are the widest in the city. It was really apparent we can make them greener and there is an opportunity for infill,” said Vancouver’s general manager of planning, Brian Jackson.

Those laneway buildings could accommodate up to 2,000 of the 10,000 new people anticipated in the next 30 years. The city will require that 50 per cent of the new units be geared to families, with two or more bedrooms.

Like almost every new building proposal or plan for density that has come to the city in the past five years of Vision Vancouver rule on council, the idea has fierce opponents and quiet supporters.

It was in the West End that the first anti-development activist group sprang up four years ago, followed by many others in neighbourhoods around the city. Back then, the issue was two controversial towers proposed under the Vision council’s ambitious policy to give developers incentives to build rental apartments instead of condos.

The opposition forced council to slow down and put a planning process in motion.

That group, West End Neighbours, is encouraging its supporters to oppose the plan that includes the laneway proposal, the result of three years of work, and ask for more time before it is approved.

But relatively few people from that neighbourhood have participated in recent general protests or delegations to council meetings organized by other groups objecting to plans and development proposals in their own neighbourhoods.

Filmmaker Aerlyn Weissman, who has gone to some of the city’s information meetings, said she is dubious about the whole plan, including the laneway housing.

“The alleys are already pretty intensely used – emergency vehicles, parking, garbage trucks. How are we going to infill the alleys and have access to all of the services?” Ms. Weissman said. She also said the idea was sprung on people only in the last few months of consultations, which she said has been a bad pattern for city planners in recent years.

But Christine Ackermann, president of the West End Residents Assocation, said residents and the city have been discussing infill laneway housing for years.

She said the new housing would be a valuable addition, especially because it would have room for families.

In addition to the laneway housing, the West End plan proposes limiting new towers mainly to the Burrard and Georgia corridors marking the border between the West End and the rest of downtown.

It also spells out heights and densities that would be allowed in various zones, how much money would be spent for a new library, pool, community centre and parks, and where new housing would not be allowed.

Unlike the rest of Vancouver, the area would not be permitted under the plan to have condos above businesses in the busy commercial strips. It would largely prohibit new development, except for the infill, from the interior of the neighbourhood.

Mr. Jackson said it was important not to allow a lot of development in the interior because it would endanger the huge amount of low-cost rental if property owners ripped down older buildings to put up taller ones.

Ms. Ackermann said she believes many people support the plan because the city has “made the right choice” by limiting development in the core.

Whether those people will come out on Wednesday in support, she is not sure.

 

Categories: Uncategorized

  • jenables

    What is a mini apartment? Is it a micro suite? Fifty percent have to be two bedroom “or more” so families can live in the alleys, I mean laneways. I can only think of one alley big enough right now. Does this give anyone else the heebie jeebies? There is a lot going on in the alleys!! You know, I kind of feel like the west end is already full of people. There IS such a thing. Why the push to add 10, 000 more?(unless I am reading that wrong)

  • boohoo

    @1

    Perhaps you should read the plan, it answers your questions. Laneway discussion around page 40.

    http://vancouver.ca/files/cov/west-end-community-plan-2013-nov.pdf

  • Visionista

    1….2….3…. queue the Vision apologists.

    wait for it ahh here they come

    let the slagging begin and the “Vision is golden” apologists start their spin now…

    let the attacks begin

  • rph

    Like anything – all alleys are not created equal. Living along one that is close neighbours to late night restaurants or bars may be more problematic. And as these are only going up to six stories, you are going to be pretty close to any noise.

    If the city goes ahead with traffic reduction measures on the streets, will this move more traffic to these alleys or laneways?

    I like the restriction in not allowing commercial/retail to be torn down and replaced by condos above businesses.

  • IanS

    @rph #3:

    “If the city goes ahead with traffic reduction measures on the streets, will this move more traffic to these alleys or laneways?”

    In my experience from years living in the West End, there’s already a fair bit of traffic going through the alleys due to the way the streets have been configured in the West End. Davie and Denman Street are already such terrible streets to drive on, I usually end up cutting through the West End, through alleys, when I drive that way.

  • Mark

    @Jen – Regarding your heebie jeebies, I think that one major reason that the laneways can be on the seedier side is because they are poorly lit, have poor visibility, and generally just have less people in them.

    I’d imagine that if you brightened and cleaned them up, tucked dumpsters away cleverly, put in sidewalks, trees and other amenities where possible, and let people live there with windows facing out into the lane, it would stop being a seedy place and instead become a normal place that people live in and hopefully take care of.

    In the older European cities there are tons of examples of densely populated laneway type streets where it doesn’t feel like a seedy alley, but instead just a narrow street, alive with people.

    Just a few randomly dropped into street views in Madrid to give some examples:

    https://maps.google.ca/maps?q=madrid&hl=en&ll=40.418691,-3.709554&spn=0.003696,0.008256&sll=49.239986,-122.958169&sspn=0.201961,0.528374&t=h&hnear=Madrid,+Community+of+Madrid,+Spain&z=18&layer=c&cbll=40.418782,-3.70948&panoid=YDxvTfmP7mDxscZnFEPzhw&cbp=12,33.76,,0,7.66

    https://maps.google.ca/maps?q=madrid&hl=en&ll=40.412745,-3.70971&spn=0.014786,0.033023&sll=49.239986,-122.958169&sspn=0.201961,0.528374&t=h&hnear=Madrid,+Community+of+Madrid,+Spain&z=16&layer=c&cbll=40.412805,-3.709479&panoid=YUNtHaCEqtuCIxCYrAmjtA&cbp=12,243.57,,0,5.09

    https://maps.google.ca/maps?q=madrid&hl=en&ll=40.411197,-3.70603&spn=0.003696,0.008256&sll=49.239986,-122.958169&sspn=0.201961,0.528374&t=h&hnear=Madrid,+Community+of+Madrid,+Spain&z=18&layer=c&cbll=40.411197,-3.70603&panoid=omfb4hCu-qRTatypX-yuWw&cbp=12,70.89,,0,5.73

  • Westender1

    The first one of these laneway infill developments has already been approved for a heritage house on Barclay Street:

    http://vancouver.ca/files/cov/committees/dev-permit-board-staff-report-1862-barclay-DE415926.pdf

    The site is currently for sale, presumably because the economics of the development don’t make sense.

    I suspect the economics also won’t make sense for most of the sites in the West End where laneway infill development is required to be rental. Planning staff noted that over the 30 year life of the plan, only 750 to 1,000 people are anticipated to be accommodated through laneway infill. I think even City staff are recognizing that this is not going to create a great deal of housing. The livability issues of principal rooms facing onto lanes at grade level, and privacy impacts between existing buildings on these sites are additional challenges.

    The vast majority of the new housing (for approximately 90% of the new residents, based on staff’s presentation to Council) will be built in large podium and tower developments in the Burrard and Alberni corridors, and along Lower Robson and Lower Davie. These were exactly the types of developments that caused concern from neighbourhood residents over the past 5 years, and the building types that were shown in the City’s own surveys to be least favoured by residents.

    So it’s disappointing that the City and the media continue to focus on laneway infill as the significant change for the West End in the coming decades. The change in the West End will come in the conversion of Lower Davie Street from a mix of low-rise and mid-rise developments with open space between to new mixed-use development at 7.0 FSR. Thirty-five storey buildings will be coming to Robson Street at 8.75 FSR (!) Development in the Burrard corridor will be in 30, 40, and 50 storey buildings, but the new community plan provides no guidance on maximum density for this area. It would seem that part of the terms of reference for the plan – to provide certainty – has been missed for this area.

  • ThinkOutsideABox

    Isn’t that the main through-line whole point of creating a plan? To provide certainty?

  • boohoo

    @6

    Plans are visions, guiding documents. There are no certainties.

  • ThinkOutsideABox

    Also not impressed that planners slipped in the last minute large changes to view corridor protections, and that they shrunk the tower separation between buildings on the same block face despite saying the contrary in council.

    But columnists don’t focus on factual details for public consumption when ordinary residents raise these concerns. Instead they are characterized as “anti-development” reading like gossip.

    the little fact that parking has been put back on the main West End streets during rush hours because the space isn’t needed any more for commuters.

    I think those that live close to Denman and Pacific, as well as Translink would disagree. Several parking metered spots along Davie, Denman and Robson just before an intersecting road have been disabled and converted to a ‘do not stop’ stretch of road despite the removal of parking restrictions. The intent was to allow space for right turning cars during rush hour to have road space to move a lane over before making the right turn so as to get out of the way of traffic in the through lane that turning cars were holding up – as requested by Translink so as not to hold up their buses during rush hour traffic.

  • ThinkOutsideABox

    Mark, in each of the examples of the google street view links above, tagging graffiti can be seen on building surfaces – a blight often seen in West End laneways as well. To me tagging’s a bit unsettling when I see it, and I suspect for others as well, which contributes to the feeling of heebie jeebies.

  • Frances Bula

    @TOAB. Okay, it’s Friday and I’m tired, but, really, do you people never get tired of just shitting on people without taking into consideration any of the realities? Your parking comments about Denman and Pacific are interesting. You could have simply posted something, saying, “Hey Frances, I know the report made it look like X, but you might want to know the following.” Instead, you have to turn it into some kind of attack on asshole media people.

    I don’t usually say things like this because it sounds too snivelly, but … I invite you to come do my job one week. Try to cover the entire city (not just your block), try to absorb thousands of details and figure out which ones are important, which ones sound right or new or interesting, try to reflect all the different points of view you hear out there, try to capture it all in the approximately 15,000 words a month you manage to type out, and try not to get irritated every time someone craps on you for not knowing what’s happening with “several parking metered spots” on particular streets.

    Okay, the end. I am going to have a stiff drink now.

  • Ned

    TOAB #8

    “Also not impressed that planners slipped in the last minute large changes to view corridor protections, and that they shrunk the tower separation between buildings on the same block face despite saying the contrary in council.”

    Yap.
    It happened. And guess who couldn’t wait a moment to congratulate Vancouver’s planning team and council (for quickly approving the plan)… none other than the “new born” kisser upper, Brent Toderean.
    Read from his twitter “brilliancy” right here:

    “Brent Toderian ‏@BrentToderian 21 Nov

    Congratulations to #Vancouver’s excellent @WestEndPlan Planning Team, led by Holly Sovdi & Kevin McNaney, on last night’s Council approval.”

    Need I say anything else?

  • Westender1

    Mark, I don’t disagree that some of the lanes in the West End could be improved. But these improvements are not going to be funded by the City. They are only going to arise through development of laneway infill housing, and typically only for the frontage of the property being re-developed. By the City’s own admission, it is anticipated that a maximum of one or two laneway infill developments might take place on each block. So it might be a bit “optimistic” ? (trying to pick language carefully here to avoid shitting on anyone) to show renderings of completely rebuilt lanes with gardens, sidewalks, lighting and lollipop stands (and no dumpsters).

  • Terry M

    Frances @12
    ROTFLMAO!
    Tough lady, eh?
    TOAB
    …Whipped!
    Ned,
    I know, but can you blame the guy? he’s getting close to the last $ of his severance! 🙂
    Westender1
    +1

  • Mark

    Westender1, that’s a fair point I hadn’t considered. It’s clear looking around the Madrid areas that there is a consistency to the amenities that must be the work of the city.

    If in the West End’s case it was just up to each development to take care of just their property, you could get something like a hundred meters of nice European style lane, then the sidewalk ends and you end up back in a grimy alley.

    If the city wouldn’t (or couldn’t) take up the responsibility of improving the lanes end to end (at least the sidewalk/trees/lights part of it anyway), I could see it not working so nicely.

    Frances – If it’s worth anything, I’ve always found your articles to be well written, researched and balanced.

    It’s the internet… For every person who takes the time to write an angry, ranting or personal attacking comment on a story, a few hundred other people read it, found it informative, interesting or just plain unremarkable, and moved on without commenting.

    Keep it up, and enjoy the well deserved drink.

  • Roger Kemble

    This is a good plan . . .

    Now shuddup!

  • teririch

    I have a question and openly admit, I am rather ‘ignorant’ to the ins and outs involved in laneway or alley planning…. but how does it or does it, (or will it) effect emergency response vehicles?

    I know typically that they use the streets, but with one way street areas, traffic etc, will there be an negative impact ?

    Like I said, just curious.

  • Lewis N. Villegas

    Frances, I remember coming upon that english expression in my early teens—for the first time, as a spanish-speaker—and laughing. Asking myself, “Why the bull?” Why not the cow, the horse or the pig?

    The West End Plan, which I spent 2 hours reviewing in the past week or so, suffers from the same malaise of the other neighbourhood plans brought down in the past couple of years—including my own neighbourhood Mount Pleasant—and more.

    The WE has twice the population of Mt Pleasant and half the footprint. A little math will tell us that the problem is therefore requiring something like 4x the effort. Never mind that this is Towerland. Therefore, it is made of a different set of urban facts than just about all of the rest of the city.

    Thus, one of the consequences of building a different urbanism, is the necessity to provide a different planning analysis. Clearly—we failed.

    I can find no idea or concept about urbanism in its pages. A simple explanation of the whole is missing. Never mind a cogent analysis of each of the parts, complete with a description of how they fit together.

    Historical development, present conditions, future trends analysis—rather than gossipy histories of who and what—is missing. The ‘how’ is missing from our city planning and that just won’t do. These plans are set up for failure.

    Public Consultation we are told is one of the things we do best in Vancouver. Sure. In this world view the architect asks his client to draw the details for the house. Yet, in our real world, the architects are only hired for the rich jobs. Housing in general, and social housing in particular—the Biltmore, the tower at Fraser & Broadway—is left as a commodity product to be delivered by industry forces with the predictable outcomes.

    How about the cars—people—transit nexus? WE Plan is as silent about that as it is on mapping the physical footprint of social relationships of people living within its boundary. Here’s a hint: the boundary described as the West End is not a “neighbourhood”. It is not an area where one solution fits all. That level of nuance and understanding—heck, that degree of professional curiosity—is AWOL in this plan, and all the plans I have reviewed recently.

    The new laneway housing type… A sure sign that this administration has run out of gas. Over the past 20 years—political parties of ALL stripes—have held power in our City Hall. And, got nothing done.

    Politics appear not to be our problem.

    Let’s lead with… mental health issues presenting as homelessness in our streets; speculation in housing heating up house prices beyond the point where working families can ever afford to own a home, not a condo (revolutions have been fought over this); and the noise, pollution, and threat to human life presenting on our city arterial streets everyday…

    That is a Trifecta of Urban Facts that the West End Plan, the Council, and all the other Plans seen over the past two years and more, have been more or less *full of ——it* about.

    Blame Madama? No. Blame us… We The People.

  • Roger Kemble

    Lewis @ #19 go to section 10.3 Plazas and Parklets of the plan.

    Entonces recuerde su casa Montevideo” remember tight “pequeña Avenida apretada Sarandi con sus cafeterías y ojeadas en el Ramblas en las playas sólo unos bloques lejos.

    Piense en” lanes “como la Avenida Sarandi y” Beach Drive “como el Ramblas.

    Hay torres en el Ramblas ahora. ¡Asi es la vida!

  • ThinkOutsideABox

    Okay Frances, I can sympathize with deadlines, context and details but how do you think it reads when you quote “president” of WERA, a now defunct organization in dissolution who had no membership making unsubstantiated claims, but then over-simplify other neighbourhood associations by broad stroking everyone as “anti-development”? All are taking time out of their lives to inform themselves of the details, just like me and I’m just a plebe.

    Here I’ll try it your way:

    “Hey Frances, I know the report made it look like the plan is the result of three years of work, but you might want to know the following.
    The West End community planning process took place over 20 months, starting in April 2012, and was completed in four phases – verbatim from page 12 of the report. That’s a year and a half, not three.” How’s that, less shitty?

  • Cardero

    Mark #6: So quaint that one might look at a narrow street in Madrid (si, calle means STREET, not lane), and claim the same could be done in the West End. The Madrid streets were designed as streets, and are NOT lanes. They were designed for pedestrians only, and maybe a horse or two. Today a few may be woonerfs. You cannot compare a NA back alley to a purpose-built narrow street in Madrid.

    “tucked dumpsters away cleverly, put in sidewalks, trees and other amenities where possible” Mark #6

    Yeah, right. Keep dreaming. I know where I’d like to “tuck” my dumpster.

    One might wonder the effect of this plan on property values in the West End. How can they not spike dramatically up? Yes, higher. Pack more people into your rat-infested back lane, make more money! Or better yet, sell now and get the hell out…to somewhere you can afford more than a microloft.

  • brilliant

    The plan is a copout. No redevelopment of the clipped out 3 story walkups? That guarantees future slum status or a developer kicking out everyone and upgrading the place out of affordable status (you know who you are).

    And no touching the decaying 1 story retail because council is afraid of future whiny condo owners?! Suck it up, zone it for rental and require decent soundproofing.

  • brilliant

    Ps Frances hang in there! Hope that drink went down smooth and easy.

  • Anne M

    I think this is the parking change that was mentioned:

    “No more rush hour parking restrictions if you’re driving on some downtown Vancouver streets.

    Normally you can’t park between 3 p.m. and 6 p.m. on Robson, Davie and Denman but that’s all changing with a pilot project.

    Lon Leclair with the City of Vancouver says the rules are no longer needed.

    They’ll also be getting rid of some parking spaces all together near intersections.

    “There’s about 23 fewer, and what will do, during rush hour, the traffic should move as well or similar to the way it does today. What those parking removals also do, is benefit the off-peak period.”

    Leclair says changes will be made as necessary especially if they find the project is causing congestion problems for TransLink.”

    From CKNW website: http://www.news1130.com/2013/08/24/parking-restrictions-removed-on-robson-davie-and-denman/

  • brian

    I think its interesting that they are reducing parking restrictions during rush hour due to declining vehicle traffic downtown. Does this parking demand is also on the decline? If so, eliminating parking in other areas may also be not that big of a deal.

    Frances: I admire your work immensely, though silently. I know a few urban-minded journos in the city and they admire your work as well.

    I fear I may come to regret wading into this, but:

    #21 TOAB

    page 12 of the plan:

    “The West End Mayor’s Advisory Committee (WEMAC) was a pilot project intended as an interim measure to a formal community planning process being undertaken for the West End. It was established by City Council in July 2010. WEMAC was responsible for communicating community priorities to the City in its planning and policy development and for helping to communicate City policy initiatives that were of interest to West End residents. ”

    I think it is fair to interpret this to mean that the plan is the culmination of 3 years of work.

  • Westender1

    Below is the plan timeline from the City of Vancouver Planning Department’s website on the process:

    http://vancouver.ca/green-vancouver/west-end-community-plan.aspx

    Details of this community plan
    The West End planning process will take place over 18 to 21 months, starting in April 2012. It will be completed in four phases:

    Launch: April – September 2012
    Focus on community issues, opportunities, goals and objectives
    Get involved through: open houses, citizen circles, walking tours, Great Places photo competition, public forums

    Policy development: September 2012 – May 2013
    Develop the West End Community Plan policies
    Get involved through: a public speakers series, workshops and open houses, walking tours

    Drafting the plan: June – September 2013
    Create a draft plan
    Get involved through: open houses, walking tours

    Plan approval: October – December 2013
    Present the draft plan for final public input and to Council for approval
    Get involved through: public presentations, open houses, Council meeting

  • Anne M

    So the formal process was 20 months and there was 3 years of work. Those are not mutually exclusive.

    As for laneway improvements, Mole Hill is the West End poster child. Presumably the lane still accommodates garbage trucks, emergency vehicles etc. Fire hydrants all in front anyway so the biggest vehicles are probably garbage trucks.

  • Jan Pierce

    So maybe someone who knows the plan better than me can answer this. What will be the impact of new six storey laneway buildings on the livability of the existing rental units. Won’t the existing apartments , up to the fourth or sixth floors, often be in total shadow and/or looking into another person’s apartment? And even people living in the next adjacent lot will lose half of their sunlight. Is there something in the plan that addresses this?

  • Frances Bula

    @TOAB. Okay, I’m a lot calmer now and am in no need of a drink, but can I just say, really nicely (because I do appreciate your participation here), that I am constantly astounded by people who will make judgments based on a couple of things they personally happen to disagree with in one story by a reporter who has written possibly dozens of stories on the same topic.

    I have quoted Randy and WEN more than once. I have also quoted many a “neighbourhood association” that consists of the five crankiest people in the hood who declared themselves to be the neighbourhood representatives. There are currently some groups in operation, possibly those you feel more aligned with, that don’t get more than a dozen out to their “annual meetings” where they choose a “president” and yet they are quoted constantly by all and sundry.

    We don’t demand to see the annual filings made to the B.C. Corporate Registry of a group before we quote them.

    When I (or anyone in the media) define groups as anti-development, it’s because that is the succinct way of describing a group whose major purpose is to question current development policies. I wouldn’t describe the Dunbar Residents Association that way. It has a long history of trying to maintain broad neighbourhood representation and it gets involved in many issues, often having to negotiate carefully because its group does indeed attract people with different opinions.

    Re whether it is a three-year process or 20 months — it is three years since council decided to do a complete West End plan rather than one-offs. If you are going to get picky about it, I’m surprised you don’t subtract all the time during the 20 months when there were no actual meetings or discussions. It was probably only a 36-day planning process if you cut out all that other time (sleeping, eating, taking out the garbage, dealing with various other city crises) when people were not directly dealing with the West End plan.

    Okay, now it’s me who’s being shitty but really, this kind of nitpicking can go on forever. And it’s all kind of beside the point.

  • Lewis N. Villegas

    Frances, just back from another of several AGMs that I attend around here this time of year… checking in on this one:

    When I (or anyone in the media) define groups as anti-development, it’s because that is the succinct way of describing a group whose major purpose is to question current development policies

    The correct syntax—I believe—would be:

    Anti-Current Development Policies Not ‘antidevelopment’. Neighbourhoods don’t have their hair on fire over “development”. The problem is that Towers are being shoved down their throats by City Hall without nary an iota of planning wisdom. It’s all about the money…

    So, shut the F— Up!

    See, I’m there. I’m showing up for that AGM. Because the worry that Tax Payers and Property Owners and Just Plain Folks in our city have is that the system is too much tilted to one side.

    Let me put it this way… We worry that it is highly un-democratic when one voice gets to the “Ear of Council” outside a Public Hearing. You know, that One Voice that is netting the City a cool $5-million-plus in CACs as is the case (roughly) at the Rize in Mount Pleasant.

    Now, we are all Canadians, and as a group we tend NOT to like to join up in oppositional groups.

    But, we do like it when watch-dogs in our ‘hood stand up and do the barking. I really don’t known how many of the over 200 that signed up to speak against the Rize ever considered they might sign up for the Residents Association of Mount Pleasant (RAMP) AGM. Not many is my guess. Many were from outside the area!

    However, I have heard it at the Jane’s Walks that I co-host; at City Hall where I find myself time and again speaking about values of community and values of place that—somehow—don’t get a hearing in the neighbourhood planning process; at the Mount Pleasant Implementation Committee (now defunct) meetings; or at my kid’s Elementary School…

    In all of these places I have heard it from the very mouth of concerned citizens that they appreciated that a “residents association” did form to oppose these ghastly, developer-driven re-zonings in the very place they call home… Whether or not more than 12 people turned up to the AGM.

    A fraud is being perpetrated in the planning of the neighbourhoods of our city. I see tangible evidence in print, radio and television that the media gets it.

  • tedeastside

    strip away people selling real estate to each other and there isn’t much of anything going on in Vancouver….sad really. a problem vancouver will have to reckon with in the future

  • rf

    All of these density plans for the west end seem rather moot unless there is going to be significant expansion of one or both of the skytrain lines into the area (and not just one stop).

    If you want young people and young families to even consider the area you just can’t expect buses and mini-shuttles to do it.

    The plan brags about 40% of people walking to work. They walk to work because it’s faster than waiting for a bus!

    Have I missed that part of the plan?
    I just don’t understand why the plan is getting so much attention when, likely, the most important detail to it’s success has been left out.

    Does this plan honestly make the West End more appealing to anyone out there in there 20’s and 30’s or who may be thinking about raising a family downtown?

  • Tessa

    Skytrain to the West End doesn’t make sense. You can’t have a skytrain line that goes one or two stops and then ends, and there are currently no lines that could reasonably be extended to the West End. Buses do the trick over short hauls, and that’s the case here: bikes I think are the other important ingredient. It’s especially good that larger units will be offered.

    I think the laneway apartments are a great idea. This, the centre city, is the perfect place to implement them, and it will give the lanes their own feel, especially if the apartments create over the long-term a sort of streetwall development like that seen in the images of Madrid. Yes, privacy is a trade-off somewhat, but I suspect that neighbourhood pointed to earlier is highly liveable despite privacy concerns. Europeans have managed for years living in close quarters, and already you can look right into other condominium windows from any unit in Yaletown.

    However, given the closeness of the buildings, I think design is going to be extra important here – in particular the materials used. I don’t want to see simple glass and concrete boxes on lanes.

    As for the rest of the plan, well, it will take some time to read, but it seems like a mixed bag. Certainly there are elements that are less popular in the neighbourhood. Some, like saving the older building stock in the middle of the neighbourhood, I wholeheartedly applaud. We’ll see how it plays out in the long run, however.

  • Frances Bula

    @TOAB. But, see Lewis, the difference between your group and some others is that you have been out there advocating for alternatives to tower development. You’ve put forward lots of thoughtful posts about how more people could be included in the neighbourhoods — just not in towers. I don’t hear that from every group.

    A couple of other points: when I (or others in the media) describe a group as anti-development, it’s a way of describing what their primary function is.

    There is a neighbourhood group in my area from which I get regular emails. It’s all about BlockWatch and crime statistics. Since every single communication I get is related to that, I would describe that group as “an anti-crime neighbourhood group” if I were ever writing about them.

    Similarly, when every single communication from a particular group is related to arguing against development in general or a development proposal in specific, it seems like a fairly accurate shorthand to say they are “anti-development.” When that group starts putting out proposals for what would be accepted in the way of development or starts getting involved in neighbourhood discussions about traffic, parks, dogs, community gardens, seniors, the health of the business community, and so on, then anyone writing about that group would come up with a different adjective.

    BTW, I would be wary of assuming that because people come up to you and say they agree that you have the general consensus of the community. I see all kinds of people — especially politicians of ruling parties — make the mistake of assuming that residents/business owners they talk to and who tell them they’re doing a great job represent everything going on out there. I can’t tell you how many politicians I’ve covered who have assumed that, because they constantly had people telling them they were doing a great job, they were popular with everyone. (I also see people who run small blogs or websites assuming the same. Because they have an audience of 1,000 or 10,000, they think they are at the head of a movement. In fact, they have gathered the small group of people around who happen to agree with them — and who are an extremely small proportion of the general population.)

    As a reporter, in spite of this blog where my critics never hold back, I tend to hear mostly from people who think I’m doing just a crackerjack job of reporting. But I know I have to be wary of believing that because that’s a built-in biased crowd. We tend to hear most from the people who agree with us. As an acquaintance of mine used to comment, wryly, back in the ’80s, “I don’t know HOW the Socreds get elected. None of MY friends votes for them.”

    Lots of people silently disagree or are not comfortable with everything a particular political group or neighbourhood group (or reporter) is doing. They won’t come up and talk to you. They’ll just silently disagree until things go over the top. Resident groups who assume everyone is with them are in as much danger as political parties who assume that the majority is with them.

  • boohoo

    @35

    Yes. I totally agree. As I’ve said before, 10, 100 or 1000 people ranting and raving does not make consensus on anything even though it feels like it does to them.

    re: skytrain in the west end. I rarely go to the west end, just nothing there I need or use. But if this is to be a big city, I would suggest skytrain in the west end makes sense. I’m under no delusion this would happen in the next 50 years but a line west of burrard bending south-west and crossing over to kits to meet up with the UBC line makes sense. Maybe it continues up Arbutus at that point. Maybe, just maybe in 50 years or so that would make sense. Perhaps it’s a tram of some sort, I don’t know. But we have to start thinking big.

  • Roger Kemble

    I think the laneway apartments are a great idea. This, the centre city, is the perfect place to implement them, and it will give the lanes their own feel, especially if the apartments create over the long-term a sort of streetwall development like that seen in the images of Madrid.

    Thanqu Tessa @ #34 The only urbane remark so far on this conversation. The first sign the town may be growing out of its hick-town status!

    Treat me to dinner sometime: somewhere very expensive please!

  • rf

    “You can’t have a skytrain line that goes one or two stops and then ends, ”

    Really? You can’t?……Hmmm…isn’t that exactly how the airport extention works?

    We’re not talking about putting people on the moon.

    If you can run the Canada line to terminate at Airport or Brighouse. You can have a run on either line that terminates in the West End and makes a couple of stops. You branch it off at Yaletown, pacific centre, or Burrard.

    My 4 year old can come up with ways to make his trains switch and go to different stations. I’m sure transportation engineers can figure that one out with real trains.

    I just don’t believe people, young or old, are going to migrate in that direction without that essential expectation being met.

    Draw points between Stadium, Terminal, Waterfront, Olympic, Pac Centre and Yaletown station. I’d bet that 95% of the population growth downtown is within blocks of that permiter and points in between.

    The west end is dying on the vine because it’s missing what people actually want. If they are not going to solve that issue, why bother with someones masterplan/masters thesis.

  • Lewis N. Villegas

    when I (or others in the media) describe a group as anti-development, it’s a way of describing what their primary function is.

    Similarly, when every single communication from a particular group is related to arguing against development in general or a development proposal in specific, it seems like a fairly accurate shorthand to say they are “anti-development.”

    FB

    Well, that is the NIMBY (not in my back yard) group, and I know them well. The vast majority of the neighbourhood population simply don’t think there is anything to be done. That is based on my work with community groups throughout British Columbia (but not in our city) engaging in downtown revitalization processes—even though ‘downtown’ has to be interpreted as the pre-1940 commercial core.

    It is a small community that venture to post.

    However, the way things are shaped in our city and our province is by the small group of investors that have access to government in a way that the citizen does not. That is a great chasm separating one and the other. Especially when as you say ‘things go over the top’.

    Which is about where we are now. Perched on the breach of an epoch making decision: are we going to follow the Hong Kong model that has been about the only money washing ashore to build ‘the downtown’ since the 1970s?

    Or are we going to strike in a different direction? Something that retains human scale, and ecological balance, even as it struggles to extend the cultural traditions that have grown up in this place rather than somewhere else? What I would describe as broad-based western European traditions, with a heavy dose from England, but often translated through the various colonial centres (including the one south of the border).

    The media has been AWOL on this story and more. The level of curiosity about what constitutes a ‘livable community’ or how we go about sustaining it has been more or less green-washed in the current Geist of right-wing, corporate dominated money-valued political discourse.

    The NIMBYs are essentially dug into what we know. Yet, as we approach these moments of paradigm shift, the questions are about what we don’t-yet-know. The emphasis should be on debate and discovery. We all like to wax poetic about our adventures abroad. Yet it is also necessary to apply a critical analysis to those other places and uncover what it is that makes their socio-economic wheels turn.

    Reporters have the megaphone. Your choice of what goes up on the blog shapes the debate. You editors are not involved on that. By the time it gets to comment #20-something, we can usually see where the general mood is at.

    Reporters in our city and region, and most commentators as well, have been hook-line-and-sinker on the tower urbanism. Clear indication that they do not travel, or have not lived, in the so-called developing world. Those models were built in the 1950s already. And the evidence is that they were disastrous.

    The social cohesion of their populations disappeared as power and wealth concentrated in ever smaller numbers. Democracy showed itself to be a faint and frail system. And now many of the ones that were able to get out, and got out are happy and proud to be Canadians.

    Yet, I worry about what I have been seeing brewing in our city for the past 20 years. Contained downtown, we can probably do a good job of it. Allowed to leech out into the neighbourhoods… I sense that all bets are off.

    Over to Port Moody, a prime case in point.

  • West End Gal

    Lewis #39
    Well said! +1