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Hornby lane counts in + asking you: What would make Hornby work better?

February 17th, 2011 · 60 Comments

Sigh. Here we go. City news release on cycling has updates on statistics for Hornby and Dunsmuir bike lanes. Deconstruct away

But in an effort to perhaps bring a new stream of ideas into the conversation, how about this? I’d love to hear your ideas for how, if the current lane were going to stay on Hornby, the street could be improved.

I use Hornby a lot myself. I have a YWCA membership. Shogun, the art gallery, and places across from the art gallery are favoured stopping spots for me.

Although I’m not driven to madness about the lanes, as some apparently are, they do seem weirdly complicated to me (all those lights! and curving lanes!). Plus, there have been changes made to parking along the street that don’t always seem to make sense.

For instance, on the block where I used to park in front of the Y all the time, parking has been banned in both the morning and afternoon rush periods. But, as I notice when I now hike in from the surrounding blocks, there’s never that much traffic in that section of the  Hornbystreet.

In the mornings, most traffic turns off Hornby before that block. In the afternoons, most people seem to be waiting to turn right and the parking lane is always empty.

So I personally would suggest taking away the new parking rules. And I’m hardly bitter at all about having my car towed from there a couple of months ago, since I never noticed the new signs after parking there for 13 years legally.

But maybe others would say that my idea is bad, though they’ve got other suggestions.

I’m wondering if anyone else has thoughts about tweaks that could be made.

Categories: Uncategorized

  • Downtowner

    Using Granville St as a pedestrian mall was a great success during the Olympics. Why not move the buses back to Seymour and turn Granville into a permanent pedestrian/bike street like those commonly seen in Europe?

    Then we could get rid of the bike lanes on Hornby with their attendant problems, while still providing a safe biking NS route through downtown. Simple and easy.

  • Deacon Blue

    Work better? I just wish it could sing, do an Irish jig, and tell a knock-knock joke.

    Let’s all sit on the curb and count bikes riding through. Meanwhile, let’s bemoan the fact that these bike lanes are going in with “bike goals” in mind. But no one seems to have thought about using the median dividers to plant trees.

    This is especially an irritant on Hornby, where the double row of trees (the tree allée) of Arthur Erickson’s Law Courts are among teh most memorable pieces of urbanism in our city.

    Didn’t have the wherewithal to engage that reality, huh?

  • Everyman

    @Downtowner #51 Given that much of the northbound traffic from the Granville Street bridge heads down Seymour, putting the busses back would just slow the rest of the vehicles down even more (as it did when busses were rerouted there). For all the foofarah over Hornby’s bike lanes, it never struck me as particularly busy vehicle street, except for the portion between Smithe and Hastings. Perhaps the city needs to look at improving the vehicle flow along Burrard, to make up for the slowing down of Hornby. Certainly the intersection on Burrard at Davie and Georgia are nightmares.

    I wish the City would undertake a complete re-evaluation of all streets in the downtown core and look at how some can perhaps be given over to cycling while others can be largely given over to vehicles. Right now it seems a scattershot approach.

  • Craigslister

    Not enough parking downtown anymore? Bike lanes snarling traffic even further? Upset that VISION doesnt listen or consult? Well when you are following an agenda or a recipe, you dont care what the peons think and Vision is following an agenda and it really doesnt care what you think.
    The bike lanes are but a precursor to what is coming.
    If you want to see the agenda, check out this website:

    http://www.metropolismag.com/html/content_0802/ped/

    It tells you how Copenahagen became the darling of the ‘get them out of their cars’ set ( read VISION VANCOUVER).
    You may be surpised at how much of this list is familiar and perhaps how much of it is sneaky and insidious. ( reducing parking downtown by a set percentage each year).

    What the website FAILS to tell you, is how they got everyone on bikes. The answer is.. with massive taxes on automobiiles. How massive? well .. take the sticker price of your new car, MORE THAN DOUBLE IT and that is how much TAX you pay. Imagine a 25% HST added on and then add another 180% of that total in car tax.
    A 15k Honda civic at 15,000 bucks becomes $52,500 before financing. That’s how come the Danes are so in love with bikes. They were bludgeoned into it. Funny how everybody just kind of leaves this out of the beautiful sustainable story.
    THIS is where VISION wants to go. Have no doubt.

    Now they might bludgeon you a different way like the DUTCH are. Starting in 2012, every car is required to have a GPS unit fitted and this will be used to charge a road useage tax. The goverment can then track and record the movements of all people in cars ostensibly to charge a tax they could easily put on fuel. This is what North Van district mayor Walton casually ‘prefers’.
    Dont be surprised how bad it gets before we can throw these social engineers out the door.
    But be sure, it isnt about traffic. It is about Holy Work. That,s why these bike lanes are so badly implemented. They are but a temporary step in the removal of all automobiles from the streets. They arent really seriously trying to accommodate cars and bikes. They are trying to replace cars with bikes. And they dont really care how they do it.

  • Bobbie Bees

    @Everyman 53
    “I wish the City would undertake a complete re-evaluation of all streets in the downtown core and look at how some can perhaps be given over to cycling while others can be largely given over to vehicles. Right now it seems a scattershot approach.”

    You actually got that completely wrong. The idea is not to make it harder to get around by car, the goal is to make it safer to get around by foot or by pedal. Unfortunately, the only way to make it safer for people on foot or on pedal is to start getting the rampaging bull under control.

  • Everyman

    @Bobbie Bees 54
    Actually, I did not get that completely wrong. I did however suggest taking a realistic look at how people get around in the downtown core and where compromises can be made that would benefit all parties.

  • Max

    In the letter Peter Ladner forwarded as a rebuttle to Rob Macdonald’s take on the Hornby bike lanes, it was mentioned that the biking advocates, the VACC had Facebook site promoting shopping on Hornby to their members.

    I came across this posted by Jill Bennett:

    Give Cyclists a Discount? Are You Kidding Me? Posted 10/3/2010 8:57:00 AM

    Earlier this week CKNW reporter Jordan Armstrong was talking to businesses on Hornby Street, asking about the “proposed” separated bike lane, when he came across a flyer that had been handed out by the Vancouver Area Cycling Coalition

    It’s called the ‘VACC Business for Bikes Program’.

    The initiative officially launched on September 28th.

    It includes a marketing guide and Consumer Outreach program where businesses are encouraged to be bike-friendly. Umm…excuse me but when did that become as issue? The businesses are bike friendly. That’s never been an issue. It’s having an unnecessary concrete barrier and bike lane rammed down their throats they aren’t too pleased with.

    But it’s the page with the section ‘How do Bikes benefit Business?’ that really makes me shake my head.

    It starts with a great statistic:

    “People who arrive by transit, foot, and bicycle visit individual stores more often and report spending more money than those who drive.”

    Really? Okay, if that is true show me the study to back it up. Well, the next line explains it came from the Clean Air Partnership Study of Bloor West Village in Toronto. Thank you for that oh so relevant information. Because as we all know, Vancouver and Toronto are exactly the same city.

    If that claim really is true then why don’t’ they have any statistics from Vancouver to back it up?

    It goes on. “Your shop visibility increases without cars parked in front.”

    Oh yes, because having all those pesky cars parked at the parking metres along the street on Hornby makes it so I really can’t see the shops at all. What’s that over there? I can’t see over that Honda Fit. Is that a hair salon? Where is the four storey Earl’s restaurant? I just can’t seem to find it with all these smart cars and Beamers parked on the street. Where on earth is it? If only these cars weren’t blocking my view. Give me a break.

    The flyer goes on to offer a few tips on how businesses can market to cyclists.

    “Offering specials or other acknowledgement for those who cycle or bring in a helmet will create a great connection.”

    WHAT? So let me get this straight, not only do cyclists want their own network of roads free of charge, now they want to get discounts for riding to the store? Are you kidding me? How does that even jive with what this city and these lunatics have been saying all along? We have been told time and time again that cyclists stop more and spend more. If that is really true then why should businesses be offering them discounts and incentives to come into their stores? Shouldn’t they already be there spending all this money they keep talking about?

    Since when did riding a bike become something that gave you a discount? And show up with a helmet to get a discount? Okay, if that’s all it takes I’ll start carrying one in my car.

    The flyer also says, “Pedestrians often feel more comfortable on sidewalks that are beside bike lanes, creating better walk by traffic.”

    Which pedestrians did they ask? I don’t know about you but I would much rather walk on a sidewalk beside traffic. At least I can trust the cars will stay on the road. Some cyclists are unpredictable and show no respect for others on the roads. They whiz by jumping on and off the curb and obviously have no idea the last four letters of the word sidewalk spell ‘walk’.

    The flyer goes on to say, “Consider delivery services or offer to hold the product for larger items.”

    Okay, the larger items thing I get. I can’t imagine any store that sold furniture or appliances that wouldn’t do that. That’s just good business.

    But a delivery service? Okay, so again, let me get this straight. We are encouraging everyone to get out of their cars and onto bikes because apparently that is what we are all supposed to do. Never mind that you don’t have a shower at work and you will be sitting at work all day marinating in your own sweat and offending co-workers. Never mind that you have kids to pack around, pets, and a bad hip. Don’t worry that it’s raining and you just don’t want to cycle the in rain. Never mind that you work shift work and riding a bike would require you to cycle home at midnight and you don’t want to. Never mind all of that.

    Because to make up for that, stores are being encouraged to offer delivery services. So, don’t put your car on the road because that’s evil. But it’s okay to shop and then get someone else to drive and deliver whatever you bought. WHAT?

    Businesses are not against cycling. That has never been the issue in this debate. The issue is a city run by people who have no business running a city doing whatever they want to because they like to ride bikes. The issue is a lack of democracy and a lack of consultation.

    The issue is 3.2 million dollars of your tax money is being spent on a bike lane experiment that isn’t an experiment at all.

    I can think of a million better uses for the paper used to print these ‘be nice to cyclists’ flyers. Instead, I will recycle the one I have and try to forget I ever read it.

  • Chris Keam

    Isn’t validated parking a discount targeted to encourage motorists to shop at certain businesses?

    No difference IMO to offering cyclists a price break.

  • spartikus

    Shorter Max, 1st half: There’s this group, see. And they have a statistic. But where’s the study! Oh, here’s the study. But it’s from Toronto! Where’s the Vancouver study!

    Shorter Max, 2nd half: It’s undemocratic that a government elected democratically is enacting a policy the majority of the electorate wants.

    Jerry Dobrovolny is standing by waiting for your coup de grace, Max.

  • Max

    @ spartikus:

    Perhaps you should take 2 seconds and read posts before commenting.

    It would award you with less confusion – I hope.